On Tue, 21 Aug 2012 16:05:37 +0100
"Paul Scott" wrote:
Likewise the ELL service has never been described as anything higher than
'up to' 18 tph in the peak on the core section, and 8 tph between Highbury
and Dalston Jn.

I don't see the purpose of terminating at Dalston Junction. Its nowheresville.
Even if you want to get the NLL you have to walk to kingsland. Why doesn't
every train just go to highbury which would be a lot more useful? Its only
another 2 stops. It just makes no sense whatsoever from a service or
passenger point of view.

B2003

About 40/45 years ago I used to travel to work from Palmers Green to Broad Street
via Finsbury Park and Canonbury Tunnel. Between Dalston Junction and Broad Street
the trains moved quite quickly and the electric trains from Richmond moved a lot faster.
Of course in those days there were no stations at Haggerston and Hoxton to slow
things up. They had been closed for the Second World War along with Mildmay Park
and had never been re-opened.

On Tue, 21 Aug 2012 11:00:21 +0100
Paul Corfield wrote:
Wait at highbury for 5 mins.

Well that's the turn round time.

Indeed. But if systems in this country were run continental style it would
be one in - one out. As soon as a train terminates another heads off. But
for some reason we can't seem to manage that here except on the DLR. The
fact that that is computer controlled rather than relying on drivers probably
says it all.

That's to balance out the headway south of Dalston relative to the
headway between Highbury and Dalston. This may change when the service
goes up to 16 tph (on the core) in December.

But its all the same line. Why does it need to be balanced when its only
gone a mile down the line? Its like the nonsense at arnos grove on the
piccadilly line.

The Overground seems to have quite relaxed schedules so as to give
recovery time and ensure high performance levels.

I wouldn't call 20mph high performance. Its not just the frequency of trains
that matters, its how fast you get to your destination once you're on one.

B2003

On Tue, 21 Aug 2012 11:58:08 +0100
Paul Corfield wrote:
Indeed. But if systems in this country were run continental style it would
be one in - one out. As soon as a train terminates another heads off. But
for some reason we can't seem to manage that here except on the DLR. The
fact that that is computer controlled rather than relying on drivers probably
says it all.

I can't think of that many lines which run like that. The only real
"in and out" service I have seen was the VAL automated metro in Lille.

Rennes is similar. But I was thinking of the Kiev Metro. A the terminus the
train arrives, reverses in the headshunt then pulls in to the outbound
platform and leaves. It doesn't wait at all and its all manually driven.
I couldn't imagine that happening in the UK - it would require decent
timekeeping and workers prepared to put in an effort and not run crying to
bob crowe every 5 mins.

impressive I found the tiny trains to be too small and I really

Yes, they are only suited to small towns really. But at least they have
them. Over here we'd still be arguing about the cost of installing a miserable
little tram line in a city the size of lille, never mind a bored tunnel metro.

wondered how they'd deal with an on train fire in the tunnel sections.

One would hope the trains are made of fireproof materials!

Sorry I wasn't clear. I meant high levels of punctuality / timekeeping
performance. Not high performance as in travelling at Ferrari like
speeds ;-)

If there was a decent service on the ELL I suspect many more people would
use it as a way to cut out zone 1 on a trip to/from canary wharf via canada
water. Which is what I used it for. In the event it would have been quicker
just to stay on the jubbly line to green park and get the victoria line.

B2003

On Tue, 21 Aug 2012 12:51:54 +0100
Paul Corfield wrote:
I wasn't convinced - they seemed very plasticky inside and the
stations were very small with narrow stairs and platforms. The
connecting doors between cars were also locked shut so no escape if
there was a fire in one car. Of course I only had a short visit so
there may well be safety features that I missed.

Hopefully there's a manual door release handle hidden somewhere. Either that
or French elf n softies is somewhat more lax than here.

It doesn't avoid Zone 1 as the DfT forced TfL to put Shoreditch High
St station inside Zone 1 to avoid abstraction of city bound commuters
from Southern and South Eastern. I don't have a Z1 ticket so I avoid

Never realised that. What a penny pinchingly vindictive thing to do.

Still it is not devoid of patronage with huge numbers connecting via
Canada Water from the south. I still think the line is well worth
having as with the rest of the Overground network. I dread to think

Certainly its better than nothing, but if the northern part intersected
with more tube lines it would be even more useful. As it is it merrily
bypasses the piccadilly, both branches of the northern and the central line
at acton. Obviously this isn't TfLs fault as its the way it was built, but
it wouldn't be beyond the wit of man to sort something out. Mind you , it might
be beyond the wit of TfL - the organisation that built a new station at
white city/wood lane for the H&C but didn't provide in gate access to white
city on the central line when it would only have required a new walkway.

B2003