On Wed, 22 Aug 2012 08:50:34 +0000 (UTC), d
wrote:


This freight business always gets mentioned but in that case can someone
explain why you can stand at an NLL station for ages and absolutely nothing
goes past? Where are all these freight trains , are they stopped somewhere
blocking the line?


It depends on the time of day. There are no freight paths during the
Monday to Friday peak hours but there could be 12 freight trains
passing through Stratford between 1030 and 1530.

--
John Ray

A good point. I have had the same experience dozens of times,
although once or twice two freight trains have passed while I've
been waiting for my train.

About 40/45 years ago I used to travel to work from Palmers Green to Broad Street
via Finsbury Park and Canonbury Tunnel. Between Dalston Junction and Broad Street
the trains moved quite quickly and the electric trains from Richmond moved a lot faster.
Of course in those days there were no stations at Haggerston and Hoxton to slow
things up. They had been closed for the Second World War along with Mildmay Park
and had never been re-opened.

Steve Fitzgerald ] wrote on 22 August 2012 16:12:42 ...
In message , d
writes

The NLL is also a busy freight route. Ken had to fight hard to get the
present frequencies.

This freight business always gets mentioned but in that case can someone
explain why you can stand at an NLL station for ages and absolutely nothing
goes past? Where are all these freight trains , are they stopped somewhere
blocking the line?

I think part of the problem is the freight companies pay for paths to be
available for them whether they use them or not and don't want to give
them up.

Freight path usage varies quite frequently as demands come and go. You
can't put a timetable in place for a whole year as with passenger
services. When the 2011 timetable for the refurbished NLL was being
planned, it included 4 freight paths per hour through Willesden Junction
High Level, plus other freight paths elsewhere on the line.

When I last studied the freight usage of the line at Acton Wells a few
years ago, there were about 70 freight train paths actually in use on
weekdays between 06:00 and 23:00, though typically about 50 on any one
day. That was just one location where passenger and freight services
need to mesh together. There are several such flat junctions along the
NLL where freight trains enter or leave the NLL. You might not see the
freight train that was holding up your Overground train because it left
the NLL before your station.
--
Richard J.
(to email me, swap 'uk' and 'yon' in address)

I don't see the purpose of terminating at Dalston Junction. Its
nowheresville.
Even if you want to get the NLL you have to walk to kingsland. Why doesn't
every train just go to highbury which would be a lot more useful? Its only
another 2 stops. It just makes no sense whatsoever from a service or
passenger point of view.

I'd be interested in knowing the answer to this too. If there isn't a good
reason for this not to happen would this also mean there was never a good
reason for the two bay platforms at Dalston Junction?

On Wed, Aug 22, 2012 at 08:50:34AM +0000, d wrote:

This freight business always gets mentioned but in that case can someone
explain why you can stand at an NLL station for ages and absolutely nothing
goes past? Where are all these freight trains , are they stopped somewhere
blocking the line?

They have paths allocated but only use them if there's freight to carry.
Whether the path will be used is not known until shortly beforehand.

It would be a logistical nightmare to run passenger trains in those
paths at short notice if the paths are available. You couldn't predict
in advance where all your trains were, so couldn't schedule them for
maintenance so efficiently. And it would also annoy passengers to have
trains that run seemingly at random.

--
David Cantrell | top google result for "internet beard fetish club"

Support terrierism! Adopt a dog today!

"Graham J" wrote in message
...

I'd be interested in knowing the answer to this too. If there isn't a
good reason for this not to happen would this also mean there was never a
good reason for the two bay platforms at Dalston Junction?

To run the whole service reliably (and it's designed for up to 18 or even 20
tph ultimately) with adequate turnround times and margins you'd need a four
platform station at Highbury, and there isn't room.

Paul S

On Thu, 23 Aug 2012 12:03:18 +0100
"Paul Scott" wrote:
"Graham J" wrote in message
...

I'd be interested in knowing the answer to this too. If there isn't a
good reason for this not to happen would this also mean there was never a
good reason for the two bay platforms at Dalston Junction?

To run the whole service reliably (and it's designed for up to 18 or even 20
tph ultimately) with adequate turnround times and margins you'd need a four
platform station at Highbury, and there isn't room.

Turnaround times are not a necessity. There is absolutely no reason why
one train can't leave immediately another arrives. That only requires 2
platforms. IIRC highbury has 3.

B2003

On Thu, 23 Aug 2012 14:01:35 +0100
Paul Corfield wrote:
Even the most automated system will have a turnround time of about 30
seconds. I can't think of a system anywhere that runs to that sort of
headway as platform dwell times to allow for door cycle times and

I didn't mean the same train to go out and come in - i meant another train
already there waiting to leave as soon as one pulls in. God knows they
managed it at arnos grove enough in the past with a cockfosters train
leaving 10 seconds before an arnos grove terminator opened its doors.

B2003

To run the whole service reliably (and it's designed for up to 18 or even
20
tph ultimately) with adequate turnround times and margins you'd need a
four platform station at Highbury, and there isn't room.

I was just wondering what the factors are that makes Highbury different from
other two platform terminals with higher service levels, e.g. Brixton on the
Victoria Line. That's a genuine question by the way, I am sure they are
many and various but I don't really know what they are. Paul has already
suggested that something as simple as the distance to the scissors crossover
would be one factor (assuming it couldn't have been placed somewhere else).
I wouldn't be surprised if something like passengers tending to wait around
on the platforms for a direct train instead of taking the first one and then
waiting further down the line would be a factor too.

G.