On 26/12/2012 22:58, Roland Perry wrote:

Having walked from Platform 1 to the Victoria Line (which is almost
directly below) via that enormously circuitous route, they have
definitely missed a trick in not having a short-cut from the end of
Platform 0/1/2 to the Victoria (and Picc) lines.

You keep missing the point. The design of the KX-St.Pancras complex
isn't anything to do with the railway stations, it's a shopping centre
which just happens to have a few railway stations scattered about the
periphery :-). If they put in all the obvious short-cuts (I'd really
like one connecting St.Pancras low-level to the tube system without
going up two floors then all the way down again) we wouldn't have the
lure of all those retail outlets presented to us, and then we might not
spend so much on their fast food and tat.

--
Clive Page

On 27 Dec, 12:30, Clive Page wrote:
On 26/12/2012 22:58, Roland Perry wrote:

Having walked from Platform 1 to the Victoria Line (which is almost
directly below) via that enormously circuitous route, they have
definitely missed a trick in not having a short-cut from the end of
Platform 0/1/2 to the Victoria (and Picc) lines.

You keep missing the point. *The design of the KX-St.Pancras complex
isn't anything to do with the railway stations, it's a shopping centre
which just happens to have a few railway stations scattered about the
periphery :-). *If they put in all the obvious short-cuts (I'd really
like one connecting St.Pancras low-level to the tube system without
going up two floors then all the way down again) we wouldn't have the
lure of all those retail outlets presented to us, and then we might not
spend so much on their fast food and tat.

Very droll, although I concede there is a grain of truth in what you
say. The lack of a direct link from the Thameslink platforms to the
tubes, et al, is very poor.

OTOH I suspect that the long route from the Victoria and Piccadilly
lines to the northern ticket hall is a safety issue. The Euston Road
exits could easily become overwhelmed. This would be acceptable given
a travelator. As it is there are folks for whom the distance could be
very unfortunate.

In message
, at
04:40:04 on Thu, 27 Dec 2012, 77002 remarked:
I suspect that the long route from the Victoria and Piccadilly
lines to the northern ticket hall is a safety issue.

Given that the Northern Ticket Hall is where it is, there's not really a
shorter route to the Piccadilly Line under platform 0. The Victoria Line
is beyond, and because it's re-using the foot tunnel from the old
KX-Thameslink entrance the access to the platforms is excessively to the
east. http://www.perry.co.uk/images/kx-composite.jpg

(Picture dates from about four years ago, before any of the new works
were open, but it turns out is quite close to reality).

The "missing link" is from the south of the new Thameslink platforms[1]
to the Northern Line, but the Fleet River duct is the usual excuse.

[1] not pictured, but underneath the legend on the western edge of StP.
--
Roland Perry

"77002" wrote in message
...

I suspect that the long route from the Victoria and Piccadilly
lines to the northern ticket hall is a safety issue. The Euston Road
exits could easily become overwhelmed. This would be acceptable given
a travelator. As it is there are folks for whom the distance could be
very unfortunate.

So, having spent goodness knows how many millions on the replan, it is not
"fit for purpose".

(and that's not a question).

My mother (88) would not have been able to walk the ridiculous routes as
signposted.

Fortunately, I equipped her with a copy of Roland Perry's diagram of how NOT
to have a coronary between platforms.
--
Brian
"Fight like the Devil, die like a gentleman."

Clive Page wrote:
On 26/12/2012 22:58, Roland Perry wrote:

Having walked from Platform 1 to the Victoria Line (which is almost
directly below) via that enormously circuitous route, they have
definitely missed a trick in not having a short-cut from the end of
Platform 0/1/2 to the Victoria (and Picc) lines.

You keep missing the point. The design of the KX-St.Pancras complex
isn't anything to do with the railway stations, it's a shopping centre
which just happens to have a few railway stations scattered about the
periphery :-). If they put in all the obvious short-cuts (I'd really
like one connecting St.Pancras low-level to the tube system without going
up two floors then all the way down again) we wouldn't have the lure of
all those retail outlets presented to us, and then we might not spend so
much on their fast food and tat.

But there aren't any "retail opportunities" in the underground labyrinth
connecting the tube tunnels to the barriers.

On 27/12/2012 15:05, Recliner wrote:
But there aren't any "retail opportunities" in the underground labyrinth
connecting the tube tunnels to the barriers.

But there's a vast number connecting the Thameslink platforms and for
that matter the Midland Main Line platforms with the tube system,
whether you choose to go the length of the old St.Pancras station or
across in the King's Cross direction and then down.

--
Clive Page

Clive Page wrote:
On 27/12/2012 15:05, Recliner wrote:
But there aren't any "retail opportunities" in the underground labyrinth
connecting the tube tunnels to the barriers.

But there's a vast number connecting the Thameslink platforms and for
that matter the Midland Main Line platforms with the tube system, whether
you choose to go the length of the old St.Pancras station or across in
the King's Cross direction and then down.

True, but the original complaint had been about the longer routes from the
Picc and Vic platforms to the exits, and those have no shops. As for the
new TL platforms, they actually are quite a long way from the tube
platforms, shops or no shops. And 50% of the human race (ie, women) do
actually like shops and shopping...

In message

, at 17:06:51 on Fri, 28 Dec 2012, Recliner
remarked:
But there aren't any "retail opportunities" in the underground labyrinth
connecting the tube tunnels to the barriers.

But there's a vast number connecting the Thameslink platforms and for
that matter the Midland Main Line platforms with the tube system, whether
you choose to go the length of the old St.Pancras station or across in
the King's Cross direction and then down.

True, but the original complaint had been about the longer routes from the
Picc and Vic platforms to the exits, and those have no shops. As for the
new TL platforms, they actually are quite a long way from the tube
platforms, shops or no shops.

The southern end of the TL platforms are actually very close to the
western end of the Northern Line platforms. And it's only a short
escalator from the eastern end of the Northern Line platforms to the
Piccadilly Line.

And 50% of the human race (ie, women) do actually like shops and
shopping...

Although I'm told that in the Winter the St Pancras shed is so cold that
you wouldn't actually want to linger in it.
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry wrote:
In message
, at 17:06:51 on Fri, 28 Dec 2012, Recliner remarked:
But there aren't any "retail opportunities" in the underground labyrinth
connecting the tube tunnels to the barriers.

But there's a vast number connecting the Thameslink platforms and for
that matter the Midland Main Line platforms with the tube system, whether
you choose to go the length of the old St.Pancras station or across in
the King's Cross direction and then down.

True, but the original complaint had been about the longer routes from the
Picc and Vic platforms to the exits, and those have no shops. As for the
new TL platforms, they actually are quite a long way from the tube
platforms, shops or no shops.

The southern end of the TL platforms are actually very close to the
western end of the Northern Line platforms. And it's only a short
escalator from the eastern end of the Northern Line platforms to the Piccadilly Line.

And 50% of the human race (ie, women) do actually like shops and shopping...

Although I'm told that in the Winter the St Pancras shed is so cold that
you wouldn't actually want to linger in it.

True on the higher level (a gale blows right through the shed), not so bad
at ground level.

On 28/12/2012 23:06, Recliner wrote:
True, but the original complaint had been about the longer routes from the
Picc and Vic platforms to the exits, and those have no shops.

That bit I really didn't understand, as the original routes from Picc
and Vic platforms to the original tube ticket hall still exist, and I
use them frequently.
As others have pointed out in this thread, you can still use the
original routes to reach King's Cross, and of course St.Pancras.

new TL platforms, they actually are quite a long way from the tube
platforms, shops or no shops. And 50% of the human race (ie, women) do
actually like shops and shopping...

I think you generalise far too much. I know lots of women who do not
like shopping in the over-priced stalls around a railway station, and
especially if they use the station frequently, wouldn't dream of using
any of them more than once in very many visits.

--
Clive Page