In message , at 13:22:13 on Wed, 22 Jun
2016, d remarked:

Anyone going into management needs to understand large scale economics,

That would be at board level. The average project level manager just needs to
know how to use Word and powerpoint and how to pass the buck down the heirarchy
effectively.

You must have worked for dysfunctional organisations. Departmental
managers need to understand economics. How can you possibly draw up
coherent budgets without. (And yes, I'm aware of the difference between
economists and accountants).

And one person's jack of all trades is another's Renaissance man.

Sure, if they're jack AND master of all trades.

Not *all* trades, but I'm proud to have been educated in every branch of
engineering, and then the economics etc previously mentioned.

As you mentioned in an earlier posting, too much concentration on the
state-of-the-art-today in a university education gets quickly out of
date.
--
Roland Perry

On Wed, 22 Jun 2016 14:38:12 +0100
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 13:22:13 on Wed, 22 Jun
2016, d remarked:

Anyone going into management needs to understand large scale economics,

That would be at board level. The average project level manager just needs to
know how to use Word and powerpoint and how to pass the buck down the
heirarchy
effectively.

You must have worked for dysfunctional organisations. Departmental

I was going to say I've worked at a lot of the major investment banks, but
that hardly disproves your point

Not *all* trades, but I'm proud to have been educated in every branch of
engineering, and then the economics etc previously mentioned.

You must be using a liberal definition of educated. Electronic engineering on
its own can take a lifetime to truly get to grips with and even then digital
engineers often don't really "get" analogue , and vice verca. I'm sure its the
same for mechanical, structural etc.

--
Spud

In message , at 13:58:11 on Wed, 22 Jun
2016, d remarked:

I'm proud to have been educated in every branch of
engineering, and then the economics etc previously mentioned.

You must be using a liberal definition of educated. Electronic engineering on
its own can take a lifetime to truly get to grips with and even then digital
engineers often don't really "get" analogue , and vice verca. I'm sure its the
same for mechanical, structural etc.

I've spent enough time studying all of those to "get" them, and also
know how to find someone to do this week's implementation.

I found it very frustrating when designing PCs for people to say that I
could only possibly know about either the software or the hardware, when
I think someone designing PCs has a duty to know both.
--
Roland Perry

On Wed, 22 Jun 2016 16:05:30 +0100
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 13:58:11 on Wed, 22 Jun
2016, d remarked:

I'm proud to have been educated in every branch of
engineering, and then the economics etc previously mentioned.

You must be using a liberal definition of educated. Electronic engineering on
its own can take a lifetime to truly get to grips with and even then digital
engineers often don't really "get" analogue , and vice verca. I'm sure its the
same for mechanical, structural etc.

I've spent enough time studying all of those to "get" them, and also
know how to find someone to do this week's implementation.

So if someone asked you to design a car engine or a class D audio amplifier
or a new forth bridge you wouldn't have a problem them?

I found it very frustrating when designing PCs for people to say that I
could only possibly know about either the software or the hardware, when
I think someone designing PCs has a duty to know both.

Certainly helps.

--
Spud

In article ,
(David Cantrell) wrote:

On Tue, Jun 21, 2016 at 05:01:30PM +0100, Basil Jet wrote:

... The Stourbridge Town branch ...

Out of interest, does anyone know how that line is worked? I tried to
have a look on google maps' overhead view, but almost all the line is in
too much shadow to make much out. Wikipedia says it has two fly-wheel
powered vehicles, but it's single track and doesn't appear to have any
passing loops. So is it operated as just "one engine in steam" like, eg,
the Talyllyn used to run, with the second vehicle being a spare for when
the first is undergoing maintenance?

I think you're right. It's s short shuttle, out and back from Stourbridge
Junction. It wasn't very busy the only time I went on it. The railbuses have
a diesel engine as well as a flywheel.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

On 2016\06\22 17:54, wrote:
In article ,
(David Cantrell) wrote:

On Tue, Jun 21, 2016 at 05:01:30PM +0100, Basil Jet wrote:

... The Stourbridge Town branch ...

Out of interest, does anyone know how that line is worked? I tried to
have a look on google maps' overhead view, but almost all the line is in
too much shadow to make much out. Wikipedia says it has two fly-wheel
powered vehicles, but it's single track and doesn't appear to have any
passing loops. So is it operated as just "one engine in steam" like, eg,
the Talyllyn used to run, with the second vehicle being a spare for when
the first is undergoing maintenance?

I think you're right. It's s short shuttle, out and back from Stourbridge
Junction. It wasn't very busy the only time I went on it. The railbuses have
a diesel engine as well as a flywheel.

The one used on Sunday is LPG rather than diesel. I don't know if they
use a longer one in the week.

In article , (Basil Jet)
wrote:

On 2016\06\22 17:54, wrote:
In article ,
(David Cantrell) wrote:

On Tue, Jun 21, 2016 at 05:01:30PM +0100, Basil Jet wrote:

... The Stourbridge Town branch ...

Out of interest, does anyone know how that line is worked? I tried to
have a look on google maps' overhead view, but almost all the line is
in too much shadow to make much out. Wikipedia says it has two
fly-wheel powered vehicles, but it's single track and doesn't appear to
have any passing loops. So is it operated as just "one engine in steam"
like, eg, the Talyllyn used to run, with the second vehicle being a
spare for when the first is undergoing maintenance?

I think you're right. It's s short shuttle, out and back from
Stourbridge Junction. It wasn't very busy the only time I went on it.
The railbuses have a diesel engine as well as a flywheel.

The one used on Sunday is LPG rather than diesel. I don't know if
they use a longer one in the week.

It could be LPG not diesel. I couldn't tell. As far as I know there are 2
similar vehicles.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

wrote:
In article , (Basil Jet)
wrote:

On 2016\06\22 17:54, wrote:
In article ,
(David Cantrell) wrote:

On Tue, Jun 21, 2016 at 05:01:30PM +0100, Basil Jet wrote:

... The Stourbridge Town branch ...

Out of interest, does anyone know how that line is worked? I tried to
have a look on google maps' overhead view, but almost all the line is
in too much shadow to make much out. Wikipedia says it has two
fly-wheel powered vehicles, but it's single track and doesn't appear to
have any passing loops. So is it operated as just "one engine in steam"
like, eg, the Talyllyn used to run, with the second vehicle being a
spare for when the first is undergoing maintenance?

I think you're right. It's s short shuttle, out and back from
Stourbridge Junction. It wasn't very busy the only time I went on it.
The railbuses have a diesel engine as well as a flywheel.

The one used on Sunday is LPG rather than diesel. I don't know if
they use a longer one in the week.

It could be LPG not diesel. I couldn't tell. As far as I know there are 2
similar vehicles.

Yes, there are two similar Class 139 PPM60 vehicles, both LPG powered, with
2.3l four cylinder industrial engines used to spin up the flywheel:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Rail_Class_139

They're effectively LPG hybrid vehicles, using a flywheel rather than a
battery to regenerate and store power. It sounds like a good idea, but
Parry hasn't managed to sell any more People Movers.

On 22/06/2016 14:12, d wrote:

JNugent wrote:
On 22/06/2016 09:41, d wrote:

How will restricting them to current levels suddenly make the price go up?
Will there be a mass surge of people who hearing about the restrictions
suddenly get the urge to fly?

I didn't say that prices would "suddenly" go up. The timescale obviously

[material dishonestly and unconvincingly snipped by spud because he
couldn't deal with it]

Oh right, glad we cleared that up. So its just supposition then.

I cleared up your lie about "suddenly", which was entirely your word,
never mine.

The first world, despite its current woes, is getting richer. Even the
third world is gettig richer. People are becoming more affluent
worldwide. Even at the (current real terms) £80 return fare to Italy, my
grandparents never had sufficient disposable income to be able to
indulge themselves in such a way.

Indulge - good word. Sums it up. It would be interesting to ask someone in
the 3rd world whether they'd prefer normal weather for their crops or some
cheap flights.

Ask away. They don't vote here. At least, not unless the infamous
Birmingham Labour Party has *really* got its act together nowadays.

Spare me your pathetic attempt at sarcasm. Besides which, the future
enviromental considerations of unlimited air travel trump the economics.

So you claim.

So many claim. If the enviroment goes tits up no amount of Adam Smiths or
Keynes or Friedmans will be riding to the rescue.

"If".

Perhaps you can produce an example of a market in which restricted
supply in the face of constant or increased demand results in lower prices?
Sorry... that doesn't actually matter, does it?

No, it doesn't.

Since no example can possibly be produced, I didn't think it would, somehow.

After all, it's only "little people" you want priced out of travel.

I care about my kids future. You only apparently give a **** about yourself
and your cheap holidays. I wonder which one of us in the future would be
judged the selfish git?

Like I said, it's only "little people" you want priced out of travel.

Given a lot fly half empty you're
probably right. Perhaps we should reduce them.

Or perhaps people like you should just keep your noses out of other
peoples' business?

If it negatively affects me and my descendents it IS my business.

Does that apply to everything that might affect you?

IOW, are you (only in your own imagination, mind) a monarch?

it's a thought...

Enjoy it, I doubt you have many.

Living in a soceity that its trying to make the future better

....by making it worse.

means
occasionally you and "Joe" will have to make an ever so slightly small
sacrifice. If that means taking one flight less a year or not being able to
drive your car into a city every other day - and I feel your pain, I really
do - then I don't have a problem with that.

Jawohl, mein Fuhrer.

Paging Mr Godwin...

You're the nazi hereabouts.

On 22/06/2016 14:22, d wrote:
On Wed, 22 Jun 2016 11:03:21 +0100
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 09:39:11 on Wed, 22 Jun
2016, d remarked:

If you don't understand economics then it leads to all sorts of poor
decisions.

I think modern students are pretty sussed on their own personal economics.
When you're going to have to pay back up to 27K for a 3 year course you're not
going to dick about with some jack of all trades degree if potential employers
want specialists.

Anyone going into management needs to understand large scale economics,

That would be at board level. The average project level manager just needs to
know how to use Word and powerpoint and how to pass the buck down the heirarchy
effectively.

And is that why you ignore every law and tenet of economics?

And one person's jack of all trades is another's Renaissance man.

Sure, if they're jack AND master of all trades. No one is going to hire a
plumber who "knows a bit" and bodges it together with blu tak.