On 20/01/2019 12:44, Theo wrote:
Basil Jet wrote:
That would make the tourist areas look like crap. It's better and
cheaper to have charging pads in the road at termini and other lengthy
stops. This was, and presumably still is, used on bus route 69 with
charging pads at Canning Town and Walthamstow.

https://www.london.gov.uk/questions/2017/3271

They seem to manage tram wires in Princes Street. And indeed in many
Continental historic centres. You could of course wire less touristy parts
- most cities have main thoroughfares where buses are concentrated.

The trouble with inductive charging is you can get much less power transfer
than a wired connection, and it's less efficient.

I wonder how much the no. 69 runs on electric, and how much it's a pure
diesel bus?
goes digging
57% in EV mode - not bad:
https://www.lowcvp.org.uk/assets/pre...ald,%20TfL.pdf
Although 16kW isn't that great for charge power.

Okay, well put overhead on the bus terminus then, and make it overhead
rails so it can't get blown down. Pretty much anything is better than
electric wires down every main road in the city.

--
Basil Jet - Current favourite song...
What by Bruce
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtJEAud9vao

On 21/01/2019 08:03, Basil Jet wrote:
On 20/01/2019 12:44, Theo wrote:
Basil Jet wrote:
That would make the tourist areas look like crap. It's better and
cheaper to have charging pads in the road at termini and other lengthy
stops. This was, and presumably still is, used on bus route 69 with
charging pads at Canning Town and Walthamstow.

https://www.london.gov.uk/questions/2017/3271

They seem to manage tram wires in Princes Street.Â* And indeed in many
Continental historic centres.Â* You could of course wire less touristy
parts
- most cities have main thoroughfares where buses are concentrated.

The trouble with inductive charging is you can get much less power
transfer
than a wired connection, and it's less efficient.

I wonder how much the no. 69 runs on electric, and how much it's a pure
diesel bus?
goes digging
57% in EV mode - not bad:
https://www.lowcvp.org.uk/assets/pre...ald,%20TfL.pdf

Although 16kW isn't that great for charge power.

Okay, well put overhead on the bus terminus then, and make it overhead
rails so it can't get blown down. Pretty much anything is better than
electric wires down every main road in the city.


As I say, the electric buses here seem to manage a full day on a fairly
intensive service without needing more than an overnight charge at the
depot.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

Graeme Wall wrote:
As I say, the electric buses here seem to manage a full day on a fairly
intensive service without needing more than an overnight charge at the
depot.

It's certainly feasible to have 100% battery buses. They are just very
expensive, and hence why they only show up when subsidised - Stagecoach,
First et al are not buying them as the natural option instead of diesel
buses. China has made good progress in this area, but with heavy government
subsidies.

It's a tradeoff whether more fixed infrastructure (charging at bus stations,
route wiring) costs less than larger batteries in vehicles. I suspect that
will depend on a case-by-case basis.

Theo

In message , at 11:49:54 on Mon,
21 Jan 2019, Theo remarked:
As I say, the electric buses here seem to manage a full day on a fairly
intensive service without needing more than an overnight charge at the
depot.

It's certainly feasible to have 100% battery buses. They are just very
expensive, and hence why they only show up when subsidised - Stagecoach,
First et al are not buying them as the natural option instead of diesel
buses. China has made good progress in this area, but with heavy government
subsidies.

It's a tradeoff whether more fixed infrastructure (charging at bus stations,
route wiring) costs less than larger batteries in vehicles. I suspect that
will depend on a case-by-case basis.

Bear in mind also that the infrastructure to charge overnight includes
extra grid feeds to provide the power to the garage/parking-lot.

If the buses were running on power from overhead lines, not only is the
demand spread over 16hrs rather than 8hrs, but it's likely that at least
some could come from existing feeds for the overhead lines as they
traverse the wider area.
--
Roland Perry

On 21/01/2019 13:52, Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 11:49:54 on Mon,
21 Jan 2019, Theo remarked:
As I say, the electric buses here seem to manage a full day on a fairly
intensive service without needing more than an overnight charge at the
depot.

It's certainly feasible to have 100% battery buses.Â* They are just very
expensive, and hence why they only show up when subsidised - Stagecoach,
First et al are not buying them as the natural option instead of diesel
buses.Â* China has made good progress in this area, but with heavy
government
subsidies.

It's a tradeoff whether more fixed infrastructure (charging at bus
stations,
route wiring) costs less than larger batteries in vehicles.Â* I suspect
that
will depend on a case-by-case basis.

Bear in mind also that the infrastructure to charge overnight includes
extra grid feeds to provide the power to the garage/parking-lot.

If the buses were running on power from overhead lines, not only is the
demand spread over 16hrs rather than 8hrs, but it's likely that at least
some could come from existing feeds for the overhead lines as they
traverse the wider area.

Buses only working for 16 hours a day! In the provinces maybe.

--
Basil Jet - Current favourite song...
What by Bruce
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtJEAud9vao

In message , at 07:00:30 on Tue, 22 Jan
2019, Basil Jet remarked:

Bear in mind also that the infrastructure to charge overnight
includes extra grid feeds to provide the power to the
garage/parking-lot.
If the buses were running on power from overhead lines, not only is
the demand spread over 16hrs rather than 8hrs, but it's likely that
at least some could come from existing feeds for the overhead lines
as they traverse the wider area.

Buses only working for 16 hours a day! In the provinces maybe.

Nah, out in the provinces it's more like 9hrs a day if you are lucky.
And that's the bus *routes*. Individual buses aren't running 20hrs a day
even if there are timetable slots for a few late night/early morning
ones.

However, the proposition that 16hrs is an underestimate makes my
original point even more relevant!
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 11:49:54 on Mon,
21 Jan 2019, Theo remarked:
As I say, the electric buses here seem to manage a full day on a fairly
intensive service without needing more than an overnight charge at the
depot.

It's certainly feasible to have 100% battery buses. They are just very
expensive, and hence why they only show up when subsidised - Stagecoach,
First et al are not buying them as the natural option instead of diesel
buses. China has made good progress in this area, but with heavy government
subsidies.

It's a tradeoff whether more fixed infrastructure (charging at bus stations,
route wiring) costs less than larger batteries in vehicles. I suspect that
will depend on a case-by-case basis.

Bear in mind also that the infrastructure to charge overnight includes
extra grid feeds to provide the power to the garage/parking-lot.

If the buses were running on power from overhead lines, not only is the
demand spread over 16hrs rather than 8hrs, but it's likely that at least
some could come from existing feeds for the overhead lines as they
traverse the wider area.

I wonder if any of the cable ducts that once supplied tram and trolley
buses feeder cabinets and pillars are still in place and what condition
they are in , some sections will no doubt have been destroyed or
deteriorated too far or repurposed for communication cables.

GH