On Sun, 18 Jul 2004 23:36:30 +0100, "Paul Weaver"
wrote (more or less):

"Just zis Guy, you know?" wrote in message
.. .
On Sun, 18 Jul 2004 19:46:58 +0100, "Paul Weaver"
wrote in message
:

GErman Autobahns seem to throw that out of the window. Sure you can't
design
a road for "no speed whatsoever", but theres no need for a limit on many
roads. At least that's what the most populous country in Euroep seems to
think.

Have you checked the comparitive fatality figures? Last time I looked
the Autobahn was substantially more dangerous per mile travelled than
our motorways.

Much lower then the states, but a quick gogole doesnt reveal anything. As we
have one of the lowest fatality rates in the world it wouldn't surprise me
if Germany was higher. What if you compare Germany accident rates to Italy
or France though

Oh, and last time I checked they also had limits on the Autobahn.

Only in certain areas

i.e. round about junctions...


(which makes perfect sense to me, 100mph on the M5 as
it joins in M6 is probably not a great idea, 100mph on the M5 from Exeter up
to Bristol is generally fine)

Most of the system is limitless (for cars)

But the Germans are now seriously discussing restricting all autobahn.


Oh, and last time I checked, their other roads do have speed limits.

Yes they do. Of course they have a decent autobahn system which means people
only travel in towns and on small roads when they are near their
destination. This of course reduces traffic in and arround towns, and
therfore accident rates.


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On Mon, 19 Jul 2004 00:52:59 GMT, Gawnsoft wrote:



Oh, and last time I checked they also had limits on the Autobahn.

Only in certain areas

i.e. round about junctions...


(which makes perfect sense to me, 100mph on the M5 as
it joins in M6 is probably not a great idea, 100mph on the M5 from Exeter up
to Bristol is generally fine)

Most of the system is limitless (for cars)

But the Germans are now seriously discussing restricting all autobahn.


As with many things, the situation with Autobahn speed limits is not as
simple as it first seems.

There are many stretches of Autobahn with speed limits. Speed limits are
often applied to reduce noise at night in urban areas and in potentially
dangerous situations such as long, steep downhills or on very bendy roads.
Variable speed limits are becoming more common, particularly on stretches
with fog risk. The vicinity of junctions is often limited. Being as
limits are common on the busiest Autobahns there's an element of truth in
saying that a very considerable proportion of Autobahn driving is done on
speed regulated sections.

A further complication is the existence of a recommended speed limit of
130kph throughout the system (where not otherwise limited). Drivers
exceeding this limit who are involved in accidents are often held to be
partially liable for the accident even though they have not broken the law.
They have to prove that the accident would not have occurred had they been
driving at 130kph.

This means that even where there is not a statutory speed limit on German
Autobahns personal liability and insurance considerations apply downward
pressure on the top speeds.

Also, most of the Autobahn network is two lane and there's plenty of
slow-moving traffic so it's often difficult to reach high speeds.

--
Michael MacClancy
Random putdown - "He is not only dull himself, he is the cause of dullness
in others." -Samuel Johnson
www.macclancy.demon.co.uk
www.macclancy.co.uk

Michael MacClancy of wrote:
As with many things, the situation with Autobahn speed limits is not as
simple as it first seems.

There are many stretches of Autobahn with speed limits.
snip
This means that even where there is not a statutory speed limit on German
Autobahns personal liability and insurance considerations apply downward
pressure on the top speeds.

Another consideration is that Autobahn speed limits are perceived to be
actively enforced. One of my German friends was caught by a camera
exceeding a limit, fined and is apparently at risk of losing her licence for
a repeat offence. Everyone else's view on her being caught was that it is a
totally routine event and caused no surprise. In contrast, although I have
UK acquaintances who have been caught speeding, I can't remember any caught
on a motorway, although I know a lot more UK motorists than German ones.
--
If debugging is the process of removing bugs, then programming
must be the process of putting them in.
Steph Peters delete invalid from lid
Tatting, lace & stitching page http://www.sandbenders.demon.co.uk/index.htm

Steph Peters wrote:
Another consideration is that Autobahn speed limits are perceived to
be actively enforced. One of my German friends was caught by a camera
exceeding a limit, fined and is apparently at risk of losing her
licence for a repeat offence. Everyone else's view on her being
caught was that it is a totally routine event and caused no surprise.
In contrast, although I have UK acquaintances who have been caught
speeding, I can't remember any caught on a motorway, although I know
a lot more UK motorists than German ones.

Me. Twice. 85 mph M1 and M50


--
slightly greasy solar atoms...

Steph Peters wrote:

Another consideration is that Autobahn speed limits are perceived to
be actively enforced. One of my German friends was caught by a camera
exceeding a limit, fined and is apparently at risk of losing her
licence for a repeat offence. Everyone else's view on her being
caught was that it is a totally routine event and caused no surprise.
In contrast, although I have UK acquaintances who have been caught
speeding, I can't remember any caught on a motorway, although I know
a lot more UK motorists than German ones.

They certainly seem to be more rather more conscientious about obeying the
limit on the restricted bits. Notably at roadworks.

--

Dave Larrington - http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk/
================================================== =========
Editor - British Human Power Club Newsletter
http://www.bhpc.org.uk/
================================================== =========

On Tue, 20 Jul 2004 at 11:16:31, Dave Larrington wrote:

They certainly seem to be more rather more conscientious about obeying the
limit on the restricted bits. Notably at roadworks.

Yes, when we drove down to near Salzburg via Cologne the other year, we
commented that it would be nice to drive at 130 kph on the German
motorways. Unfortunately, it was either raining, or there were
road-works, or both, and I don't think we got as high as 130 kph all
day! Then there was a crash just past Munich, which delayed us even
further....
--
Annabel Smyth
http://www.amsmyth.demon.co.uk/index.html
Website updated 18 July 2004