Arthur Figgis wrote:

And the bus I was on tonight got trapped in roadworks at Norwood
Junction, and the driver had to ask the passengers if they knew of any
diversions he should be following instead :-)


That's amazing. The road works, and associated diversions, started on
2nd August; perhaps he had just returned from his holidays?

As for the South Norwood diversions, I now live on a bus route. 3
different services pass my door, and I am regularly woken at around 0550
when the first one of the day goes by. This will last, apparently, until
the end of October; perhaps I will have got used to it by then!

--
John Ray, London UK.

Just to follow up some of Paul's points:

In message , Paul Corfield
writes
Extras on the 15 are supposed to operate between Aldgate and Aldwych
during the District Line weekend closures. Having travelled on the 15
from Tower on a normal day with full Tube services in operation I can
tell you it gets besieged then as well!
I would have expected this to some extent because of it being the only
major route to serve the Tower these days. However, the crush loadings
continued well after closing time at the Tower and the stop one to the
West of Tower Hill (Eastcheap?) seemed to attract very heavy use, too,
which puzzled me a bit.

I think one inspector would not cope. You actually need several customer
service people to help if you actually want the inspector to be
controlling the service.
Then I suspect that that would be a good use of manpower.

That said, the abuse being suffered by the member of staff guarding the
gate at the (closed) Tower Hill station had to be seen to be believed.
You would have thought he had personally and on a whim decided to close
that part oft he system.

Welcome to hell.
You don't have to tell me!

Driver Information
No it isn't too much to ask but as in all things you get people who are
not enthused. I expect that a route like the 15 is dreadful from this
viewpoint because so many tourists use it. As soon as you show any
semblance of being knowledgeable or helpful you will get completely
surrounded by people wanting help - I'm sure you know how that feels :-)
Indeed I do! I often take my Blue Badge off when I finish a job now
just to prevent this. It's not being unhelpful, it's just that you do
indeed get besieged.

(A few weeks ago, I was walking across the Millennium Bridge early one
evening. I'd finished a job a little earlier and was taking my coach
driver over to see the Globe and some other developments on the
Bankside. A (South African?) lady coming the other way spotted my
Badge and asked a question about Saint Paul's Cathedral. When I told
her that it was now closed she asked if she could get a bus from there
to the Tower. I told her yes and that it was the 15 and - as you say!
- I was suddenly surrounded by other people who seemed to come from
nowhere, all asking different questions about Bankside, the Bridge and
countless other things. My driver ended up rescuing me!)

Well I am going to have a nice trip in to work on the 73 as I can get my
local route to Seven Sisters. Most mornings I see the Routemasters
pouring out of the garage about 1-2 mins apart
I recently watched the film "The Nine Road" for the first time. You
reminded me of the early morning scenes in that!

The Metroline vehicles used on the 205 all have good loud PA systems on
them. I just think a lot of drivers are reticent to use them and there
is no compulsion so to do
Whereas it ought to be a requirement of the job. Divers might be
reticent but it's a useful service (and would in fact help drivers in
the long run).

but the point is well made for the 205 - one
of the better inventions for the congestion charge services.
It's the first time I've used it. We had to get from Tower Hill to
Marylebone and I couldn't face the 15 again so walked to Aldgate!

But these are really just observations. In two and a half days' really
intensive use of the system, it managed to get us there everywhere every
time. It did it late in the evening, when Paris's transport system
would have been skeletal and that of most other British cities
non-existent and my essential belief in London having a Good Transport
System was not shaken.

Well exactly - we all have bad journeys at times but the system works
far more times than it fails.
Absolutely.

Glad you had a good stay.
Thanks! (Although I more or less feel like a resident these days, so
much time do I spend in London seeing it from a leisure perspective was
both interesting and useful.)
--
Ian Jelf, MITG, Birmingham, UK
Registered "Blue Badge" Tourist Guide for
London & the Heart of England
http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk

In message , Arthur Figgis
] writes
Foreigners, bendy-bus users, or fare dodgers?

Mostly foreigners.
--
Ian Jelf, MITG, Birmingham, UK
Registered "Blue Badge" Tourist Guide for
London & the Heart of England
http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk

On Mon, 16 Aug 2004 18:58:19 +0100, Annabel Smyth
wrote:

Ian Jelf wrote to uk.transport.london on Mon, 16 Aug 2004:

Do drivers believe that they have any role in helping people who are
unsure of where they're going?

As always, in London, you have two sorts of bus drivers (and
conductors); those who will go out of their way to be helpful - they'll
see you running towards the bus and wait for you - and those who go out
of their way to be unhelpful. We had an experience of the latter - I
took my guests on a 159 up to Westminster Bridge, and the conductor
firmly pressed the bell for the bus to start just as we reached the
platform. He wouldn't even apologise when I remonstrated with him, nor
look at me. I have taken the bus number and plan to report his
behaviour to the PTB, as I was really angry that my guests should have
been put out in this way.

I had a similar experience with a bus yesterday. Some of our local
routes are diverted at present. You are advised to catch the bus at a
different tube station in order to avoid a long extra bus trip. The bus
just completely refused to stop so I was straight onto London Buses
Customer Services to complain. I resisted the temptation to complain to
Arriva as well but if it happens again I shall be going a little higher
up the chain than a Customer Services help desk. Completely and utterly
unacceptable behaviour.
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

"Peter Lawrence" a écrit dans le message de
...
On Mon, 16 Aug 2004 09:48:01 +0100, Ian Jelf
wrote:

Does anyone believe in queuing in an orderly fashion at bus stops any
more?

No! We have never managed to persuade the tourists to adopt this
quaint custom; and they tend to be in the majority.

SNIP

Indeed, those who aware that an official on-line rail ticket agency is
called "Queue-Jump" must conclude that elbowing one's way to the front of
the waiting throng is now regarded as praiseworthy evidence of the
competitive spirit...

Regards,

- Alan (in Brussels - mind the spamtrap)

"Ian Jelf" wrote:

(re route 15)

I would have expected this to some extent because of it being the only
major route to serve the Tower these days. However, the crush loadings
continued well after closing time at the Tower and the stop one to the
West of Tower Hill (Eastcheap?) seemed to attract very heavy use, too,
which puzzled me a bit.

Nearest stop for the main entrance/exit to Fenchurch Street station. With
the District closed west of Whitechapel, east Londoners were being advised
to get to Fenchurch Street by National Rail and then, well, fend for
themselves.....

Chris

On Tue, 17 Aug 2004 18:12:22 +0100, Paul Corfield
wrote:

On Mon, 16 Aug 2004 18:58:19 +0100, Annabel Smyth
wrote:

Ian Jelf wrote to uk.transport.london on Mon, 16 Aug 2004:

Do drivers believe that they have any role in helping people who are
unsure of where they're going?

As always, in London, you have two sorts of bus drivers (and
conductors); those who will go out of their way to be helpful - they'll
see you running towards the bus and wait for you - and those who go out
of their way to be unhelpful. We had an experience of the latter - I
took my guests on a 159 up to Westminster Bridge, and the conductor
firmly pressed the bell for the bus to start just as we reached the
platform. He wouldn't even apologise when I remonstrated with him, nor
look at me. I have taken the bus number and plan to report his
behaviour to the PTB, as I was really angry that my guests should have
been put out in this way.

I had a similar experience with a bus yesterday. Some of our local
routes are diverted at present. You are advised to catch the bus at a
different tube station in order to avoid a long extra bus trip. The bus
just completely refused to stop so I was straight onto London Buses
Customer Services to complain. I resisted the temptation to complain to
Arriva as well but if it happens again I shall be going a little higher
up the chain than a Customer Services help desk. Completely and utterly
unacceptable behaviour.

And it has happened AGAIN with another Arriva bus on a different route
and the driver thought it would be a breeze to hold me hostage on his
bus and not stop to let me off until two stops after the one I
requested. I have complained again but now the next stop is an E Mail to
Peter Hendy.
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

Paul Corfield wrote to uk.transport.london on Wed, 18 Aug 2004:

And it has happened AGAIN with another Arriva bus on a different route
and the driver thought it would be a breeze to hold me hostage on his
bus and not stop to let me off until two stops after the one I
requested. I have complained again but now the next stop is an E Mail to
Peter Hendy.

What is it with Arriva buses - sometimes you would reckon they think
they exist to travel from point to point without bothering about their
customers!
--
Annabel - "Mrs Redboots"
(trying out a new .sig to reflect the personality I use in online forums)

On Wed, 18 Aug 2004 19:44:37 +0100, Annabel Smyth
wrote:

Paul Corfield wrote to uk.transport.london on Wed, 18 Aug 2004:

And it has happened AGAIN with another Arriva bus on a different route
and the driver thought it would be a breeze to hold me hostage on his
bus and not stop to let me off until two stops after the one I
requested. I have complained again but now the next stop is an E Mail to
Peter Hendy.

What is it with Arriva buses - sometimes you would reckon they think
they exist to travel from point to point without bothering about their
customers!

This problem appears to affect "all flavours" of Arriva. Paul's had
problems with Arriva London North (correct me if I'm wrong), your
problems were with Arriva London South, my problems are with Arriva
East Herts and Essex, where some drivers think it's great fun to miss
out a stop at 11 p.m. on a 20 minute headway. (six weeks and still no
sensible answer from Arriva, only that the bus doesn't serve the road
I was waiting in, even though I've managed to board a bus there on a
regular basis for almost 15 years)!

--
Thomas Covenant
Please observe reply to Address.
Unsolicited mail to "From" address
deleted unread.

In message , Chris Read
writes

"Ian Jelf" wrote:

(re route 15)

I would have expected this to some extent because of it being the only
major route to serve the Tower these days. However, the crush loadings
continued well after closing time at the Tower and the stop one to the
West of Tower Hill (Eastcheap?) seemed to attract very heavy use, too,
which puzzled me a bit.

Nearest stop for the main entrance/exit to Fenchurch Street station. With
the District closed west of Whitechapel, east Londoners were being advised
to get to Fenchurch Street by National Rail and then, well, fend for
themselves.....

Ah, thanks, Chris. That would explain it.
--
Ian Jelf, MITG, Birmingham, UK
Registered "Blue Badge" Tourist Guide for
London & the Heart of England
http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk