It was my other half's birthday this weekend and I was working doing a
London walk on Sunday, so we decided to make a weekend of it playing the
tourist in London and taking in a show on Saturday evening. Not
something I ever really get to but it was a useful insight into really
intense use of public transport over three days. Just some random
observations:

With the Circle/District EC-Whitechapel not operating over the weekend,
loadings on the 15 to the Tower were very high. As no rail replacement
bus services as such were provided, some extra runs on the 15 would have
been useful. The overcrowding was severe from early morning until well
into the evening. It would have been a good use of manpower to station
an inspector at the Tower stop in particular to control passengers and
give information.

That said, the abuse being suffered by the member of staff guarding the
gate at the (closed) Tower Hill station had to be seen to be believed.
You would have thought he had personally and on a whim decided to close
that part oft he system.

Do drivers believe that they have any role in helping people who are
unsure of where they're going? The driver on a 15 we caught from the
Tower was asked by three foreign but English-speaking girls if he wen to
Embankment Station. At first he simply ignored them but when they
persisted he told them "no". I then intervened to tell them to get off
at Charing Cross station, which they did, quite happily. Before anyone
reminds me that the chap was there to drive a bus not act as a Tourist
Information Officer, can I say that I don't expect drivers to know every
street everywhere but surely major stops and stations in the Central
area isn't too much to ask?

Does anyone believe in queuing in an orderly fashion at bus stops any
more?

I don't know whether I was just unlucky this weekend (this isn't a
problem I've seen before) but there was a pretty frequent problem with
people trying to board via the middle doors of double deckers.

We took a couple of journeys on the 9, just for old time's sake (and to
go to the Science Museum). I really *do* prefer Routemasters. The
conductor called out stops, it was well ventilated and I *still* find
the legroom better than on new buses. (On one journey we sat next to
what appeared to be an enthusiast, with notebook taking details of RMs
going the other way. If you're reading this, "hello"!)

Last night we used the 205 for the first time, to get from Whitechapel
to Marylebone. Great idea and well used but given that it's a station
linking service and therefore very likely to be used by people
unfamiliar with London, on this route above all others I think that
there should be a way of announcing the stops, either by the driver
doing it or with a GPS TV system, as was used on the RV1 (but now seems
not to be?).

But these are really just observations. In two and a half days' really
intensive use of the system, it managed to get us there everywhere every
time. It did it late in the evening, when Paris's transport system
would have been skeletal and that of most other British cities
non-existent and my essential belief in London having a Good Transport
System was not shaken.

Interesting to be a tourist, if only for a while. It reminded me why I
love London so much.



--
Ian Jelf, MITG, Birmingham, UK
Registered "Blue Badge" Tourist Guide for
London & the Heart of England
http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk

"Ian Jelf" wrote in message
...

It was my other half's birthday this weekend and I was working doing a
London walk on Sunday, so we decided to make a weekend of it playing the
tourist in London and taking in a show on Saturday evening.

Never mind all this transport boll**ks, what show did you see? ;-)

Ian
(theatre fan)

In message , Ian F.
writes
"Ian Jelf" wrote in message
...

It was my other half's birthday this weekend and I was working doing a
London walk on Sunday, so we decided to make a weekend of it playing the
tourist in London and taking in a show on Saturday evening.

Never mind all this transport boll**ks, what show did you see? ;-)

Ahem, "Chitty Chitty Bang Bang"! (No escaping transport, is there?!)
--
Ian Jelf, MITG, Birmingham, UK
Registered "Blue Badge" Tourist Guide for
London & the Heart of England
http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk

"Ian Jelf" wrote in message
...

Ahem, "Chitty Chitty Bang Bang"! (No escaping transport, is there?!)

Did you have to pay the congestion charge? ;-)

Ian

On Mon, 16 Aug 2004 09:48:01 +0100, Ian Jelf
wrote:

It was my other half's birthday this weekend and I was working doing a
London walk on Sunday, so we decided to make a weekend of it playing the
tourist in London and taking in a show on Saturday evening. Not
something I ever really get to but it was a useful insight into really
intense use of public transport over three days. Just some random
observations:

With the Circle/District EC-Whitechapel not operating over the weekend,
loadings on the 15 to the Tower were very high. As no rail replacement
bus services as such were provided, some extra runs on the 15 would have
been useful. The overcrowding was severe from early morning until well
into the evening. It would have been a good use of manpower to station
an inspector at the Tower stop in particular to control passengers and
give information.

Extras on the 15 are supposed to operate between Aldgate and Aldwych
during the District Line weekend closures. Having travelled on the 15
from Tower on a normal day with full Tube services in operation I can
tell you it gets besieged then as well!

I think one inspector would not cope. You actually need several customer
service people to help if you actually want the inspector to be
controlling the service.

That said, the abuse being suffered by the member of staff guarding the
gate at the (closed) Tower Hill station had to be seen to be believed.
You would have thought he had personally and on a whim decided to close
that part oft he system.

Welcome to hell.

Do drivers believe that they have any role in helping people who are
unsure of where they're going? The driver on a 15 we caught from the
Tower was asked by three foreign but English-speaking girls if he wen to
Embankment Station. At first he simply ignored them but when they
persisted he told them "no". I then intervened to tell them to get off
at Charing Cross station, which they did, quite happily. Before anyone
reminds me that the chap was there to drive a bus not act as a Tourist
Information Officer, can I say that I don't expect drivers to know every
street everywhere but surely major stops and stations in the Central
area isn't too much to ask?

No it isn't too much to ask but as in all things you get people who are
not enthused. I expect that a route like the 15 is dreadful from this
viewpoint because so many tourists use it. As soon as you show any
semblance of being knowledgeable or helpful you will get completely
surrounded by people wanting help - I'm sure you know how that feels :-)
The cocooning of drivers behind assault screens doesn't help but they
are a necessity given risks at other times of day.

Does anyone believe in queuing in an orderly fashion at bus stops any
more?

No - I hate it but I'm afraid I'm as bad as everybody else because it is
just a rugby scrum these days.

I don't know whether I was just unlucky this weekend (this isn't a
problem I've seen before) but there was a pretty frequent problem with
people trying to board via the middle doors of double deckers.

Confusion over how the cashless zone works as well as impatience. A
recent experience on my suburban route when there was tube shut down
showed that loads of people just poured on via the middle door - such
was their desperation to get on the bus. The same happens during tube
strikes when the buses are besieged. I would hate to be a driver when
that happens.

We took a couple of journeys on the 9, just for old time's sake (and to
go to the Science Museum). I really *do* prefer Routemasters. The
conductor called out stops, it was well ventilated and I *still* find
the legroom better than on new buses. (On one journey we sat next to
what appeared to be an enthusiast, with notebook taking details of RMs
going the other way. If you're reading this, "hello"!)

Well I am going to have a nice trip in to work on the 73 as I can get my
local route to Seven Sisters. Most mornings I see the Routemasters
pouring out of the garage about 1-2 mins apart but I venture off to the
Tube. It won't be the same when they're bendy so I need one last
nostalgia trip!

Last night we used the 205 for the first time, to get from Whitechapel
to Marylebone. Great idea and well used but given that it's a station
linking service and therefore very likely to be used by people
unfamiliar with London, on this route above all others I think that
there should be a way of announcing the stops, either by the driver
doing it or with a GPS TV system, as was used on the RV1 (but now seems
not to be?).

The Metroline vehicles used on the 205 all have good loud PA systems on
them. I just think a lot of drivers are reticent to use them and there
is no compulsion so to do but the point is well made for the 205 - one
of the better inventions for the congestion charge services.

But these are really just observations. In two and a half days' really
intensive use of the system, it managed to get us there everywhere every
time. It did it late in the evening, when Paris's transport system
would have been skeletal and that of most other British cities
non-existent and my essential belief in London having a Good Transport
System was not shaken.

Well exactly - we all have bad journeys at times but the system works
far more times than it fails. Glad you had a good stay.
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

On Mon, 16 Aug 2004 09:48:01 +0100, Ian Jelf
wrote:

Do drivers believe that they have any role in helping people who are
unsure of where they're going?

It seems to vary. At least in London most stops have maps, and even
timetables, to help planning.

I saw a driver be quite abusive to a passenger asking where a bus in
Croydon went, when the week before a driver with the same company
(Connex) in the Czech Republic had been very helpful to me, despite us
not even having a common language.

In the past I've had bus drivers in North Yorkshire ask /me/ for
directions, and I've even had one borrow a map I was carrying!

Does anyone believe in queuing in an orderly fashion at bus stops any
more?

Not in London, AFAICT. It has gone the way of waiting for passengers
to get off trams, trains, etc before boarding.

I don't know whether I was just unlucky this weekend (this isn't a
problem I've seen before) but there was a pretty frequent problem with
people trying to board via the middle doors of double deckers.

Foreigners, bendy-bus users, or fare dodgers?

It did it late in the evening, when Paris's transport system
would have been skeletal and that of most other British cities
non-existent and my essential belief in London having a Good Transport
System was not shaken.

Many people don't realise just how good London's transport is - until
they go elsewhere!


--
Arthur Figgis Surrey, UK

Ian Jelf wrote to uk.transport.london on Mon, 16 Aug 2004:

Do drivers believe that they have any role in helping people who are
unsure of where they're going?

As always, in London, you have two sorts of bus drivers (and
conductors); those who will go out of their way to be helpful - they'll
see you running towards the bus and wait for you - and those who go out
of their way to be unhelpful. We had an experience of the latter - I
took my guests on a 159 up to Westminster Bridge, and the conductor
firmly pressed the bell for the bus to start just as we reached the
platform. He wouldn't even apologise when I remonstrated with him, nor
look at me. I have taken the bus number and plan to report his
behaviour to the PTB, as I was really angry that my guests should have
been put out in this way.

We then took a tourist river-boat to Greenwich and back, and then walked
along the South Bank to have dinner at Gabriel's Wharf. And then walked
on to London Bridge to catch a 35 home.
--
Annabel - "Mrs Redboots"
(trying out a new .sig to reflect the personality I use in online forums)

On Mon, 16 Aug 2004 09:48:01 +0100, Ian Jelf
wrote:

Does anyone believe in queuing in an orderly fashion at bus stops any
more?

No! We have never managed to persuade the tourists to adopt this
quaint custom; and they tend to be in the majority.

--
Ian Jelf, MITG, Birmingham, UK
Registered "Blue Badge" Tourist Guide for
London & the Heart of England
http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk

--
Peter Lawrence

On Mon, 16 Aug 2004 18:41:33 +0100, Arthur Figgis
] wrote:


In the past I've had bus drivers in North Yorkshire ask /me/ for
directions,

And the bus I was on tonight got trapped in roadworks at Norwood
Junction, and the driver had to ask the passengers if they knew of any
diversions he should be following instead :-)
--
Arthur Figgis Surrey, UK

Peter Lawrence wrote:
On Mon, 16 Aug 2004 09:48:01 +0100, Ian Jelf
wrote:

Does anyone believe in queuing in an orderly fashion at bus stops
any more?

No! We have never managed to persuade the tourists to adopt this
quaint custom; and they tend to be in the majority.

But it's no better outside Zone 1, where tourists are certainly not in
the majority. However, there are practical problems. My local bus stop
in Chiswick High Road is served by 7 routes, and often two or more buses
arrive together. It's just not reasonable to expect an orderly queuing
system in such circumstances.
--
Richard J.
(to e-mail me, swap uk and yon in address)