"ted" wrote in message
news

I note from the Indie on Sunday that allegedly the cross rail costs are
going to be born by central government and NOT put out to PP finance.
We await what actually happens on the ground.

Story at:

http://news.independent.co.uk/busine...p?story=572873

Treasury to bankroll Crossrail
By Jason Nissé
17 October 2004

The Treasury is to underwrite the entire £12bn cost of the Crossrail project
to build a rail link across London after deciding it will not be a
public-private partnership.

Though it will look for contributions of up to £2bn from London businesses
and input from Transport for London, the Treasury has accepted that the PPP
model will not work for the giant project.

Crossrail was created as a joint venture between the Strategic Rail
Authority and TfL, which is part of the London Mayor's office. However,
since then it has been approved by the Transport Secretary, Alistair
Darling, and plans have been announced to abolish the SRA. The Treasury and
the Department for Transport last week moved to assert their control over
the project, appointing financial troubleshooter Adrian Montague as
chairman.

Mr Montague wrote the report that led the Government to back the project.
The Treasury, TfL and London business leaders are working on a funding
package but it is understood that a rise in fares has been ruled out. Higher
business rates may be used but that is unlikely to raise more than £2bn.

Civil servants have persuaded the Treasury to keep the project under public
control to minimise costs. "It will be publicly funded and publicly
cliented," said a well-placed source.

Angus

On Sun, 17 Oct 2004 12:03:34 +0100 someone who may be "Angus Bryant"
quoted this:-

http://news.independent.co.uk/busine...p?story=572873

The Treasury is to underwrite the entire £12bn cost of the Crossrail project
to build a rail link across London after deciding it will not be a
public-private partnership.

That is quite a dramatic announcement if true. The Treasury has been
very much behind PFI dogma.

Civil servants have persuaded the Treasury to keep the project under public
control to minimise costs.

Glad to hear it.


--
David Hansen, Edinburgh | PGP email preferred-key number F566DA0E
I will always explain revoked keys, unless the UK government
prevents me by using the RIP Act 2000.


----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups
---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---

On Sun, 17 Oct 2004, Angus Bryant quoted the Indy as follows:

Civil servants have persuaded the Treasury to keep the project under public
control to minimise costs.

Boggle.

I mean, it's absolutely correct, but it runs directly against the last
twenty years of government dogma.

tom

--
the logical extension of a zero-infinity nightmare topology

On Sun, 17 Oct 2004 12:03:34 +0100, "Angus Bryant"
wrote:

"ted" wrote in message
news

I note from the Indie on Sunday that allegedly the cross rail costs are
going to be born by central government and NOT put out to PP finance.
We await what actually happens on the ground.

Story at:

http://news.independent.co.uk/busine...p?story=572873

Treasury to bankroll Crossrail
By Jason Nissé
17 October 2004

The Treasury is to underwrite the entire £12bn cost of the Crossrail project
to build a rail link across London after deciding it will not be a
public-private partnership.

Though it will look for contributions of up to £2bn from London businesses
and input from Transport for London, the Treasury has accepted that the PPP
model will not work for the giant project.

If this is true then it is a huge change of mind on the part of the
Treasury.

I imagine that the apparent success of the CTRL phase 1 may have
persuaded them that a large scale project can be successfully delivered
using more traditional funding methods and a well run project team.

The only key different being that where CTRL phase 1 was constructed is
nothing like the middle of London where CTRL phase 2 has encountered
rather more difficulties.

Crossrail was created as a joint venture between the Strategic Rail
Authority and TfL, which is part of the London Mayor's office. However,
since then it has been approved by the Transport Secretary, Alistair
Darling, and plans have been announced to abolish the SRA. The Treasury and
the Department for Transport last week moved to assert their control over
the project, appointing financial troubleshooter Adrian Montague as
chairman.
Mr Montague wrote the report that led the Government to back the project.
The Treasury, TfL and London business leaders are working on a funding
package but it is understood that a rise in fares has been ruled out. Higher
business rates may be used but that is unlikely to raise more than £2bn.

I just wonder whether Mr Montague is actually the person to see
Crossrail through to completion. He might be good with the funding bit
and may be trusted by the Treasury but is he tough enough to deal with
all the problems that real construction of the project will bring?

It's interesting how highly Labour value a win by Ken Livingstone in the
London Mayoral vote - how many billions will have been pushed London's
way if this leak is true? - £15-16bn?

Civil servants have persuaded the Treasury to keep the project under public
control to minimise costs. "It will be publicly funded and publicly
cliented," said a well-placed source.

It will be nice if this is true but I'm not holding my breath.
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

In article , Angus Bryant
writes
snip


Mr Montague wrote the report that led the Government to back the project.
The Treasury, TfL and London business leaders are working on a funding
package but it is understood that a rise in fares has been ruled out. Higher
business rates may be used but that is unlikely to raise more than £2bn.

Civil servants have persuaded the Treasury to keep the project under public
control to minimise costs. "It will be publicly funded and publicly
cliented," said a well-placed source.

Angus


It will be a first if any government funded, directly managed project
comes in at anything under double the budget - dome, Scottish
parliament, portcullis annex to house of parliament, NHS computer
system, etc. etc.

--
John Alexander,

Is that the sound of howling and screeching I hear coming from Lady
Thatchers Town House.........?

In article , Alek wrote:
Is that the sound of howling and screeching I hear coming from Lady
Thatchers Town House.........?

I didn't know Crossail was going to serve Grantham !

Nick
--
http://www.leverton.org/ ... So express yourself ...

John writes


It will be a first if any government funded, directly managed project
comes in at anything under double the budget - dome, Scottish
parliament, portcullis annex to house of parliament, NHS computer
system, etc. etc.

Come on its all about this bid for the Olympic games which a lot of the
country north of Watford gap couldn't care two monkeys about.
There is also the possibility that a few people will benefit
financially from this . What the effect for the local populace will be
IF it gets built time will only tell.
As to will it be built to time and budget not very likely.

ted wrote:
John writes


It will be a first if any government funded, directly managed project
comes in at anything under double the budget - dome, Scottish
parliament, portcullis annex to house of parliament, NHS computer
system, etc. etc.

Come on its all about this bid for the Olympic games which a lot of the
country north of Watford gap couldn't care two monkeys about.
There is also the possibility that a few people will benefit
financially from this . What the effect for the local populace will be
IF it gets built time will only tell.
As to will it be built to time and budget not very likely.

Not about the bid for the Olympics. The Olympic bid doesn't even include
Crossrail, and everyone knows very well that it wouldn't be finished in
time - it's scheduled for completion in 2013.

The benefits can hardly be questioned, at 2:1. And with many of the
accrued benefits returning to the Treasury in taxation, a significant
proportion of which will get spent north of Watford Gap, the rest of the
country shouldn't be too upset about it either.

--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7
www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London

On Sun, 17 Oct 2004, John wrote:

In article , Angus Bryant
writes

Mr Montague wrote the report that led the Government to back the
project. The Treasury, TfL and London business leaders are working on a
funding package but it is understood that a rise in fares has been
ruled out. Higher business rates may be used but that is unlikely to
raise more than £2bn.

Civil servants have persuaded the Treasury to keep the project under
public control to minimise costs. "It will be publicly funded and
publicly cliented," said a well-placed source.

It will be a first if any government funded, directly managed project
comes in at anything under double the budget - dome, Scottish
parliament, portcullis annex to house of parliament, NHS computer
system, etc. etc.

True. However, it would be equally remarkable if any project managed
privately did it!

tom

--
Taking care of business