With the extension to LCY well advanced and the conversion of the NLL
between Stratford and Canning Town, what junctions are planned for the
area?

If I've worked it out correctly, there will be four directions DLR
trains can go from Canning Town:

- west to Poplar
- east to Beckton
- east to LCY
- north to Stratford

This means that the following junctions could be built:

- a double flying triangle northwest of the station between the
existing DLR High Level line and the soon-to-be-converted NLL. This
allows DLR services to avoid Canning Town entirely and proceed direct
to Stratford without reversal, as well as allow direct
Stratford-Beckton and Stratford-LCY services, as well as the existing
Poplar-Beckton service

- a double junction, starting just south of the old Low Level NLL
platforms, to connect with the existing junction to LCY (this allows
trains to run to LCY and Beckton from Stratford without going through
the High Level at all)

- a chord from the old NLL platforms to the Beckton line, meeting it
east of the LCY junction (this would prevent a Stratford-LCY service
via the Low Level and would necessitate a trek from the old NLL
platforms to the existing DLR platforms)

Has any information been released on what the proposed traffic flows
and services are and what sort of junctions will be made between the
existing DLR and the NLL to allow DLR trains access? No doubt Clive
Feather (and others) can already explain the feasibility of a flying
triangle at Canning Town...

TheOneKEA wrote:
With the extension to LCY well advanced and the conversion of the NLL
between Stratford and Canning Town, what junctions are planned for the
area?

If I've worked it out correctly, there will be four directions DLR
trains can go from Canning Town:

- west to Poplar
- east to Beckton
- east to LCY
- north to Stratford

This means that the following junctions could be built:

- a double flying triangle northwest of the station between the
existing DLR High Level line and the soon-to-be-converted NLL. This
allows DLR services to avoid Canning Town entirely and proceed direct
to Stratford without reversal, as well as allow direct
Stratford-Beckton and Stratford-LCY services, as well as the existing
Poplar-Beckton service

- a double junction, starting just south of the old Low Level NLL
platforms, to connect with the existing junction to LCY (this allows
trains to run to LCY and Beckton from Stratford without going through
the High Level at all)

- a chord from the old NLL platforms to the Beckton line, meeting it
east of the LCY junction (this would prevent a Stratford-LCY service
via the Low Level and would necessitate a trek from the old NLL
platforms to the existing DLR platforms)

Has any information been released on what the proposed traffic flows
and services are and what sort of junctions will be made between the
existing DLR and the NLL to allow DLR trains access? No doubt Clive
Feather (and others) can already explain the feasibility of a flying
triangle at Canning Town...

Peak services (10tph) should run from Stratford International to
Woolwich Arsenal (5tph) and Beckton (5tph). No other direct services are
currently proposed, so I don't think they'll go to the expense of
building a west-to-north chord avoiding Canning Town.

My best guess is that a junction will be constructed northwest of
Canning Town, to allow access to the NLL route. There isn't much point
taking over the NLL platforms at Canning Town for DLR Stratford Int'l
services yet, as it will be confusing, expensive and an inconvenient
interchange. Saying that, extra platforms may be introduced in the
future as the station may need to handle a good 20tph in each direction
if the extension to Barking Reach is built. I suspect the NLL platforms
will be safeguarded for future use, as will the alignment alongside the
DLR up to the Woolwich branch junction.

--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7
www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London

Dave Arquati wrote in message ...
TheOneKEA wrote:
This means that the following junctions could be built:

- a double flying triangle northwest of the station between the
existing DLR High Level line and the soon-to-be-converted NLL. This
allows DLR services to avoid Canning Town entirely and proceed direct
to Stratford without reversal, as well as allow direct
Stratford-Beckton and Stratford-LCY services, as well as the existing
Poplar-Beckton service


My best guess is that a junction will be constructed northwest of
Canning Town, to allow access to the NLL route. There isn't much point
taking over the NLL platforms at Canning Town for DLR Stratford Int'l
services yet, as it will be confusing, expensive and an inconvenient
interchange. Saying that, extra platforms may be introduced in the
future as the station may need to handle a good 20tph in each direction
if the extension to Barking Reach is built. I suspect the NLL platforms
will be safeguarded for future use, as will the alignment alongside the
DLR up to the Woolwich branch junction.

I don't think there'd be enough space immediately northwest of the
station, you've got the River Lea, two sets of powerlines and the
newly re-done A13 Canning Town flyover in the way!

Dr. Sunil wrote:
Dave Arquati wrote in message ...

TheOneKEA wrote:

This means that the following junctions could be built:

- a double flying triangle northwest of the station between the
existing DLR High Level line and the soon-to-be-converted NLL. This
allows DLR services to avoid Canning Town entirely and proceed direct
to Stratford without reversal, as well as allow direct
Stratford-Beckton and Stratford-LCY services, as well as the existing
Poplar-Beckton service


My best guess is that a junction will be constructed northwest of
Canning Town, to allow access to the NLL route. There isn't much point
taking over the NLL platforms at Canning Town for DLR Stratford Int'l
services yet, as it will be confusing, expensive and an inconvenient
interchange. Saying that, extra platforms may be introduced in the
future as the station may need to handle a good 20tph in each direction
if the extension to Barking Reach is built. I suspect the NLL platforms
will be safeguarded for future use, as will the alignment alongside the
DLR up to the Woolwich branch junction.


I don't think there'd be enough space immediately northwest of the
station, you've got the River Lea, two sets of powerlines and the
newly re-done A13 Canning Town flyover in the way!

Hmmm. So they can't drop down from the DLR viaduct onto the NLL? More
complicated than I thought then. This would mean that the DLR would have
to use the NLL platforms, and departures to Beckton and to Woolwich
Arsenal could take place from two different platforms.

--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7
www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London

"Dave Arquati" wrote in message
...
Dr. Sunil wrote:

I don't think there'd be enough space immediately
northwest of the station, you've got the River Lea,
two sets of powerlines and the newly re-done A13
Canning Town flyover in the way!

Hmmm. So they can't drop down from the DLR viaduct
onto the NLL? More complicated than I thought then.
This would mean that the DLR would have to use the
NLL platforms, and departures to Beckton and to Woolwich
Arsenal could take place from two different platforms.

.... which wouldn't be so bad if the high level island was widened, so that
its western edge was over the western edge of the present NLL platforms, and
its eastern edge was left where it is. The high level island could then have
escalators connecting to the present NLL platform, as well as escalators
connecting it to the Jubilee platform.

--
John Rowland - Spamtrapped
Transport Plans for the London Area, updated 2001
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acro...69/tpftla.html
A man's vehicle is a symbol of his manhood.
That's why my vehicle's the Piccadilly Line -
It's the size of a county and it comes every two and a half minutes

John Rowland wrote:
"Dave Arquati" wrote in message
...

Dr. Sunil wrote:

I don't think there'd be enough space immediately
northwest of the station, you've got the River Lea,
two sets of powerlines and the newly re-done A13
Canning Town flyover in the way!

Hmmm. So they can't drop down from the DLR viaduct
onto the NLL? More complicated than I thought then.
This would mean that the DLR would have to use the
NLL platforms, and departures to Beckton and to Woolwich
Arsenal could take place from two different platforms.


.... which wouldn't be so bad if the high level island was widened, so that
its western edge was over the western edge of the present NLL platforms, and
its eastern edge was left where it is. The high level island could then have
escalators connecting to the present NLL platform, as well as escalators
connecting it to the Jubilee platform.

It took me a little while to work out what you meant (do you mean
eastern instead of western and western instead of eastern?), but it's
genius. Interchange from the Jubilee for Cody Road DLR and for any
eastbound trains originating from Stratford would be a bit annoying though.

--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7
www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London

"Dave Arquati" wrote in message
...
John Rowland wrote:
"Dave Arquati" wrote in message
...

Dr. Sunil wrote:

I don't think there'd be enough space immediately
northwest of the station, you've got the River Lea,
two sets of powerlines and the newly re-done A13
Canning Town flyover in the way!

Hmmm. So they can't drop down from the DLR viaduct
onto the NLL? More complicated than I thought then.
This would mean that the DLR would have to use the
NLL platforms, and departures to Beckton and to Woolwich
Arsenal could take place from two different platforms.


.... which wouldn't be so bad if the high level island was widened, so
that
its western edge was over the western edge of the present NLL platforms,
and
its eastern edge was left where it is. The high level island could then
have
escalators connecting to the present NLL platform, as well as escalators
connecting it to the Jubilee platform.

It took me a little while to work out what you meant (do you mean
eastern instead of western and western instead of eastern?),

slaps forehead Yes, I did, thanks. I'll try that again, in English.

..... which wouldn't be so bad if the high level island was widened, so that
its eastern edge was over the eastern edge of the present NLL platforms, and
its western edge was left where it is. The high level island could then have
escalators connecting to the present NLL platform, as well as escalators
connecting it to the Jubilee platform.

but it's genius. Interchange from the Jubilee for
Cody Road DLR and for any eastbound trains
originating from Stratford would be a bit annoying though.

Hardly. Up an escalator - walk 10 metres - down an escalator. As for the
eastbound train, you would need to examine the monitor on the high island
before knowing whether to remain there or go down the escalator for the next
eastbound train.

--
John Rowland - Spamtrapped
Transport Plans for the London Area, updated 2001
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acro...69/tpftla.html
A man's vehicle is a symbol of his manhood.
That's why my vehicle's the Piccadilly Line -
It's the size of a county and it comes every two and a half minutes

John Rowland wrote:
"Dave Arquati" wrote in message
...

John Rowland wrote:

"Dave Arquati" wrote in message
...


Dr. Sunil wrote:


I don't think there'd be enough space immediately
northwest of the station, you've got the River Lea,
two sets of powerlines and the newly re-done A13
Canning Town flyover in the way!

Hmmm. So they can't drop down from the DLR viaduct
onto the NLL? More complicated than I thought then.
This would mean that the DLR would have to use the
NLL platforms, and departures to Beckton and to Woolwich
Arsenal could take place from two different platforms.


.... which wouldn't be so bad if the high level island was widened, so

that

its western edge was over the western edge of the present NLL platforms,

and

its eastern edge was left where it is. The high level island could then

have

escalators connecting to the present NLL platform, as well as escalators
connecting it to the Jubilee platform.


It took me a little while to work out what you meant (do you mean
eastern instead of western and western instead of eastern?),


slaps forehead Yes, I did, thanks. I'll try that again, in English.

..... which wouldn't be so bad if the high level island was widened, so that
its eastern edge was over the eastern edge of the present NLL platforms, and
its western edge was left where it is. The high level island could then have
escalators connecting to the present NLL platform, as well as escalators
connecting it to the Jubilee platform.


but it's genius. Interchange from the Jubilee for
Cody Road DLR and for any eastbound trains
originating from Stratford would be a bit annoying though.


Hardly. Up an escalator - walk 10 metres - down an escalator. As for the
eastbound train, you would need to examine the monitor on the high island
before knowing whether to remain there or go down the escalator for the next
eastbound train.

True. Rushing for a train at Luton Airport Parkway with luggage is
infinitely more difficult - check monitors, dash through ticket gates,
up *4* escalators, across bridge, down flight of stairs!

--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7
www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London