I was waiting for a connection at Denmark Hill station the other day,
having travelled from Clapham High Street, and heading onwards to
Lewisham. I was amazed how many goods trains I saw on that journey - at
least two in each direction, if not three. And a huge train packed full
of Citroen C3s, which I assume had crossed via the Channel Tunnel

Presumably most of the trains going towards central London would have
come from the Tunnel, but where do they go after Clapham High Street?
--
"Mrs Redboots"
http://www.amsmyth.demon.co.uk/
Website updated 22 November 2004

"Mrs Redboots" wrote in message
...
I was waiting for a connection at Denmark Hill station the other day,
having travelled from Clapham High Street, and heading onwards to
Lewisham. I was amazed how many goods trains I saw on that journey - at
least two in each direction, if not three. And a huge train packed full
of Citroen C3s, which I assume had crossed via the Channel Tunnel

Presumably most of the trains going towards central London would have
come from the Tunnel, but where do they go after Clapham High Street?
--

Trainloads of French cars are going to Gefco in Corby, I believe that they
also export Coventry built Peugeots that way as well. You see them on the
MML, but I've no idea which way they go round London.

Peter.

"Mrs Redboots" wrote in message
...
I was waiting for a connection at Denmark Hill station the other day,
having travelled from Clapham High Street, and heading onwards to
Lewisham. I was amazed how many goods trains I saw on that journey - at
least two in each direction, if not three. And a huge train packed full
of Citroen C3s, which I assume had crossed via the Channel Tunnel

Presumably most of the trains going towards central London would have
come from the Tunnel, but where do they go after Clapham High Street?

Most of them will cross at Wandsworth Road to the West London line through
Kensington Olympia. From that line they can either run onto the West Coast
Main Line and Wembley yard, take the high level route and continue along the
North London line or touch the WCML at Willesden and then turn away to join
the Gret Western Main Line at Acton.

In message , Mrs Redboots
writes

I was waiting for a connection at Denmark Hill station the other day,
having travelled from Clapham High Street, and heading onwards to
Lewisham. I was amazed how many goods trains I saw on that journey - at
least two in each direction, if not three. And a huge train packed full
of Citroen C3s, which I assume had crossed via the Channel Tunnel

Quite a lot of this traffic probably came from the marshalling yards at
Hither Green.

Presumably most of the trains going towards central London would have
come from the Tunnel, but where do they go after Clapham High Street?

They don't go any further towards Central London. After Wandsworth Road
they turn west on the old LCDR line, first passing under the Brighton
line from Clapham Junction to Victoria, and then under all of the SWT
lines. At this point they meet Lavender Hill junction, where there is a
choice of routes.

Some will take the "right" (NW) fork onto the West London line, joining
the route from West London junction taken by Eurostars when heading to
their depot. This of course goes on to Willesden Junction and points
beyond.

Others (often longer and more interesting trains that are less well
suited to the constraints of the West London line) take the "left" (SW)
fork so that they come in on the north side of Clapham Junction (joining
the incoming West London Line). They then travel down the Windsor Line
as far as Barnes (which, while busy, is four-track all the way).

After that (and here you will see the sense in this second route) they
take the little-used Hounslow loop line out towards Kew Bridge, then
traversing the very tight eastern curve onto the North London line and
up to Willesden Junction - and then out to various destinations.

One of the delights of our "local", which overlooks the Thames near
Barnes Bridge, is seeing the variety of traffic on the Hounslow Loop -
last time I was there for lunch there was a car transporter (probably
Citroens) of staggering length - it must have been a mile of train -
several loads of aggregates, the usual Hounslow loopers, and the Orient
Express on a steam-driven lunch run (towing a miserable EWS diesel at
the rear as insurance, I noticed!). It's almost enough to turn a man
into a train-spotter

--
Paul Terry

Jack Taylor wrote to uk.transport.london on Fri, 26 Nov 2004:


"Mrs Redboots" wrote in message
...
I was waiting for a connection at Denmark Hill station the other day,
having travelled from Clapham High Street, and heading onwards to
Lewisham. I was amazed how many goods trains I saw on that journey - at
least two in each direction, if not three. And a huge train packed full
of Citroen C3s, which I assume had crossed via the Channel Tunnel

Presumably most of the trains going towards central London would have
come from the Tunnel, but where do they go after Clapham High Street?

Most of them will cross at Wandsworth Road to the West London line through
Kensington Olympia. From that line they can either run onto the West Coast
Main Line and Wembley yard, take the high level route and continue along the
North London line or touch the WCML at Willesden and then turn away to join
the Gret Western Main Line at Acton.

Thank you. Where do they de-train the freight, as a general rule - the
old goods yards are obviously a thing of the past, but equally obviously
there must be a few terminals scattered around the country. You mention
Wembley - are there any others in the London area?
--
"Mrs Redboots"
http://www.amsmyth.demon.co.uk/
Website updated 22 November 2004

Paul Terry wrote to uk.transport.london on Fri, 26 Nov 2004:

In message , Mrs
Redboots writes

I was waiting for a connection at Denmark Hill station the other day,
having travelled from Clapham High Street, and heading onwards to
Lewisham. I was amazed how many goods trains I saw on that journey - at
least two in each direction, if not three. And a huge train packed full
of Citroen C3s, which I assume had crossed via the Channel Tunnel

Quite a lot of this traffic probably came from the marshalling yards at
Hither Green.

Presumably most of the trains going towards central London would have
come from the Tunnel, but where do they go after Clapham High Street?

They don't go any further towards Central London. After Wandsworth
Road they turn west on the old LCDR line, first passing under the
Brighton line from Clapham Junction to Victoria, and then under all of
the SWT lines. At this point they meet Lavender Hill junction, where
there is a choice of routes.

Some will take the "right" (NW) fork onto the West London line, joining
the route from West London junction taken by Eurostars when heading
to their depot. This of course goes on to Willesden Junction and points
beyond.

Others (often longer and more interesting trains that are less well suited
to the constraints of the West London line) take the "left" (SW) fork so
that they come in on the north side of Clapham Junction (joining the
incoming West London Line). They then travel down the Windsor Line as
far as Barnes (which, while busy, is four-track all the way).

After that (and here you will see the sense in this second route) they
take the little-used Hounslow loop line out towards Kew Bridge, then
traversing the very tight eastern curve onto the North London line and
up to Willesden Junction - and then out to various destinations.

One of the delights of our "local", which overlooks the Thames near
Barnes Bridge, is seeing the variety of traffic on the Hounslow Loop -
last time I was there for lunch there was a car transporter (probably
Citroens) of staggering length - it must have been a mile of train -
several loads of aggregates, the usual Hounslow loopers, and the Orient
Express on a steam-driven lunch run (towing a miserable EWS diesel at
the rear as insurance, I noticed!). It's almost enough to turn a man into
a train-spotter

Thanks, Paul. Yes, it does sound like a good place to see trains! I
didn't know there were marshalling yards at Hither Green, I shall have
to investigate....
--
"Mrs Redboots"
http://www.amsmyth.demon.co.uk/
Website updated 22 November 2004

"Mrs Redboots" wrote in message
...

Thanks, Paul. Yes, it does sound like a good place to see trains! I
didn't know there were marshalling yards at Hither Green, I shall have
to investigate....

There's nothing significant there now. There is an engineers yard adjacent
to the depot, in the triangle between the Orpington lines and the Lee lines.
Most of the former yards on both the up and down side of the Orpington lines
are now used for stabling electric units.

"Mrs Redboots" wrote in message
...

Thank you. Where do they de-train the freight, as a general rule - the
old goods yards are obviously a thing of the past, but equally obviously
there must be a few terminals scattered around the country. You mention
Wembley - are there any others in the London area?

Wembley is the major international freight yard for the London area - most
of the traffic that uses that yard (and Willesden Brent) is trainload and
simply recessing for crew or locomotive changes, although a small amount of
remarshalling still takes place. It's things like automotive trains, en
route to/from Europe from/to the relevant car manufacturers' own sidings or
to other places such as Daventry or Hams Hall distribution centres (some of
this bypasses London, having been processed at Dollands Moor, adjacent to
the Channel Tunnel entrance in Kent).

Acton yard, adjacent to the Great Western Main Line, on the north side of
the line just before Ealing Broadway, is significantly smaller and handles
more domestic freight, especially stone trains from Foster Yeoman or Hanson
Aggregates in Somerset. There is a stone terminal at the back of Acton Yard
itself. Acton also splits/joins the 'jumbo' trains that run from/to
Merehead into portions for smaller stone terminals in the South East.

The majority of the other marshalling yards around London have now gone,
most recently Temple Mills in East London. A *very* small amount still takes
place at Dagenham Dock, in the area previously occupied by Ripple Lane
depot. The concentration on trainload freight in the 1980s and the
abandonment of wagonload business has obviated the need for most yards,
since trains run from one private siding to another without (usually)
remarshalling en route, except in the instances given above.

Jack Taylor wrote to uk.transport.london on Sat, 27 Nov 2004:

Wembley is the major international freight yard for the London area - most
of the traffic that uses that yard (and Willesden Brent) is trainload and
simply recessing for crew or locomotive changes, although a small amount of
remarshalling still takes place. It's things like automotive trains, en
route to/from Europe from/to the relevant car manufacturers' own sidings or
to other places such as Daventry or Hams Hall distribution centres (some of
this bypasses London, having been processed at Dollands Moor, adjacent to
the Channel Tunnel entrance in Kent).

Thanks (rest snipped)


--
"Mrs Redboots"
http://www.amsmyth.demon.co.uk/
Website updated 22 November 2004

"Mrs Redboots" a écrit dans le message de
...
Jack Taylor wrote to uk.transport.london on Fri, 26 Nov 2004:


"Mrs Redboots" wrote in message
...
I was waiting for a connection at Denmark Hill station the other day,
having travelled from Clapham High Street, and heading onwards to
Lewisham. I was amazed how many goods trains I saw on that journey -
at
least two in each direction, if not three. And a huge train packed
full
of Citroen C3s, which I assume had crossed via the Channel Tunnel

Presumably most of the trains going towards central London would have
come from the Tunnel, but where do they go after Clapham High Street?

Most of them will cross at Wandsworth Road to the West London line
through
Kensington Olympia. From that line they can either run onto the West
Coast
Main Line and Wembley yard, take the high level route and continue along
the
North London line or touch the WCML at Willesden and then turn away to
join
the Gret Western Main Line at Acton.

Thank you. Where do they de-train the freight, as a general rule - the
old goods yards are obviously a thing of the past, but equally obviously
there must be a few terminals scattered around the country. You mention
Wembley - are there any others in the London area?

Yes, but note that Jack Taylor's reply deals more with marshalling yards
(most of which have been closed as redundant since the abandonment of
individual waggonload traffic) than with 'goods yards' (now called freight
terminals). Apart from private sidings used for trainload freight to/from
major manufacturers and their distribution centres, most terminals are
operated by Freightliner (www.freightliner.co.uk) for transhipping standard
containers to/from road vehicles or ships. In the London area Freightliner
has terminals at Barking (Ripple lane), Tilbury and Thamesport (Isle of
Grain). As a direct connection between CTRL2 and the Barking - Tilbury line
is now under construction at Dagenham Dock sta. at least some of the freight
traffic now passing through Denmark Hill will presumably be re-routed via it
in due course.

Regards,

- Alan (in Brussels)