Aidan Stanger wrote:


In practice they're not chucked off, so many do travel to Bluewater for
free even though they're not supposed to! They have to pay to get back,
of course.


Is the reduction of validity of Freedom Passes, i.e. beyond the Greater
London boundary, a new thing? Since you (I think it was you) raised it
earlier in the thread, I have looked at the current bus maps and there
is indeed a rather vague note to that effect, which I had not noticed
before. I ask because, within the last two months, I have travelled from
Dartford to Bluewater and back on route 96, using a Freedom Pass,
presuming the journey to be "legal", and was not asked to pay a fare;
indeed, nothing was said by the drivers. I have also travelled to
Potters Bar on a 313 and back on an 84, again without challenge.

The bus map suggests that pass holders check with the driver or phone LT
Information, which in turn suggests that the rules are not
straightforward. I wonder, for example, if someone travelling on a 107
from Barnet to Stanmore (both within the GLC boundary) would be liable
for an excess fare because this route goes via Borehamwood and Elstree,
both of which are outside the boundary?

--
John Ray

On Sun, 16 Jan 2005 09:13:50 +0000, John Ray
wrote:

Is the reduction of validity of Freedom Passes, i.e. beyond the Greater
London boundary, a new thing? Since you (I think it was you) raised it
earlier in the thread, I have looked at the current bus maps and there
is indeed a rather vague note to that effect, which I had not noticed
before. I ask because, within the last two months, I have travelled from
Dartford to Bluewater and back on route 96, using a Freedom Pass,
presuming the journey to be "legal", and was not asked to pay a fare;
indeed, nothing was said by the drivers. I have also travelled to
Potters Bar on a 313 and back on an 84, again without challenge.

The bus map suggests that pass holders check with the driver or phone LT
Information, which in turn suggests that the rules are not
straightforward. I wonder, for example, if someone travelling on a 107
from Barnet to Stanmore (both within the GLC boundary) would be liable
for an excess fare because this route goes via Borehamwood and Elstree,
both of which are outside the boundary?

This is the link to a document that answers your questions.

http://www.transportforlondon.gov.uk...cs/Freedom.pdf

--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

Paul Corfield wrote:


This is the link to a document that answers your questions.

http://www.transportforlondon.gov.uk...cs/Freedom.pdf

Thank you, most helpful; it explains why I had no problems with routes
84 and 313, and answers my question about 107. The list does however
seem a bit arbitrary, and it appears that each route was the subject of
special negotiations. I would have thought that it would be much easier
to administer, and for pass holders to understand, if the same validity
rules as for regular travel cards/bus passes were applied, but no doubt
there are reasons for Freedom Passes being treated differently.

--
John Ray

"John Ray" wrote in message
...
Aidan Stanger wrote:


In practice they're not chucked off, so many do travel to Bluewater for
free even though they're not supposed to! They have to pay to get back,
of course.


Is the reduction of validity of Freedom Passes, i.e. beyond the Greater
London boundary, a new thing? Since you (I think it was you) raised it
earlier in the thread, I have looked at the current bus maps and there
is indeed a rather vague note to that effect, which I had not noticed
before. I ask because, within the last two months, I have travelled from
Dartford to Bluewater and back on route 96, using a Freedom Pass,
presuming the journey to be "legal", and was not asked to pay a fare;
indeed, nothing was said by the drivers. I have also travelled to
Potters Bar on a 313 and back on an 84, again without challenge.

The bit beyond Dartford to Bluewater has never been legal with a freedom
pass,
Maybe the 96 drivers didn't know, notice, or couldn't be bothered.

John Ray wrote:

In practice they're not chucked off, so many do travel to Bluewater for
free even though they're not supposed to! They have to pay to get back,
of course.


Is the reduction of validity of Freedom Passes, i.e. beyond the Greater
London boundary, a new thing? Since you (I think it was you) raised it
earlier in the thread, I have looked at the current bus maps and there
is indeed a rather vague note to that effect, which I had not noticed
before. I ask because, within the last two months, I have travelled from
Dartford to Bluewater and back on route 96, using a Freedom Pass,
presuming the journey to be "legal", and was not asked to pay a fare;
indeed, nothing was said by the drivers. I have also travelled to
Potters Bar on a 313 and back on an 84, again without challenge.

No, and your experience suggests that my information could be obsolete.

I have seen drivers on the 96 at Bluewater charging freedom pass holders
(who expected it to be free) a fare at Bluewater, but that was over a
year ago (probably nearer two).

Aidan Stanger wrote:

John Ray wrote:

Is the reduction of validity of Freedom Passes, i.e. beyond the Greater
London boundary, a new thing? Since you (I think it was you) raised it
earlier in the thread, I have looked at the current bus maps and there
is indeed a rather vague note to that effect, which I had not noticed
before. I ask because, within the last two months, I have travelled from
Dartford to Bluewater and back on route 96, using a Freedom Pass,
presuming the journey to be "legal", and was not asked to pay a fare;
indeed, nothing was said by the drivers. I have also travelled to
Potters Bar on a 313 and back on an 84, again without challenge.

No, and your experience suggests that my information could be obsolete.

I have seen drivers on the 96 at Bluewater charging freedom pass holders
(who expected it to be free) a fare at Bluewater, but that was over a
year ago (probably nearer two).

Your information is, in fact, correct, and I was lucky not to be asked
to pay. It's clear from the LT document to which Paul Corfield directed
me that Freedom Passes are not valid for free travel between Dartford
and Bluewater. However, my trips to and from Potters Bar were within the
rules. It's clear that a Freedom Pass does not have quite the same
validity as a Z1-6 bus pass; I will have to be more careful in future!

--
John Ray, London UK.