Rupert Candy wrote:
Matthew wrote:

(snip)
Does anyone know the position with the gates/validators at Farringdon? A
typical scenario is an occasional journey Brighton to Moorgate and return:

1. I use my National Rail season which is valid as far as City Thameslink.

You are travelling without a valid ticket between City Thameslink and
Farringdon. To combine a paper National Rail ticket and Oyster Prepay
you must touch in where your paper ticket ends, at City Thameslink.


2. At Farringdon I validate the prepay card on the platform (does it matter
which platform I do this on?) and then
3. Change to the Underground for Moorgate.
4. At Moorgate I the prepay card lets me out through the gates.

Prepay requires a touch in and out, so your usual journey is valid
between Farringdon & Moorgate. Just touching out at Farringdon would
lead to an unresolved journey.


Fascinating. So you'd have to get out at CT, go up to the ticket hall
to touch in, then come back down again and get on another train for the
10 second journey to Farringdon?

In this case, yes.

In that case I suppose the Farringdon validators are actually intended
for people changing *onto* Thameslink, having used Prepay to get them
there on the Tube (since otherwise you would be leaving the Tube
without passing through a gateline). In fact I can't think of any way
they could be used in the opposite direction (though I suppose someone
might *theoretically* have e.g. a Brighton - Farringdon LU season...)

Not really... you could have any National Rail ticket valid to
Farringdon (e.g. a single from Luton to Farringdon) and then you would
touch in on the validators with an Oyster in order to continue your
journey on the Tube (e.g. to Whitechapel).

--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7
www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London

Dave Arquati wrote:
Rupert Candy wrote:
In that case I suppose the Farringdon validators are actually
intended
for people changing *onto* Thameslink, having used Prepay to get
them
there on the Tube (since otherwise you would be leaving the Tube
without passing through a gateline). In fact I can't think of any
way
they could be used in the opposite direction (though I suppose
someone
might *theoretically* have e.g. a Brighton - Farringdon LU
season...)

Not really... you could have any National Rail ticket valid to
Farringdon (e.g. a single from Luton to Farringdon) and then you
would
touch in on the validators with an Oyster in order to continue your
journey on the Tube (e.g. to Whitechapel).

I suppose so, but I wonder how many people in e.g. Luton realise that
if they buy a ticket to "London" it won't be valid at Farringdon, so
they have to buy a ticket to "Farringdon LU"? In other words, how many
people would *correctly* use the validators for the journey you
describe? (Obviously a rhetorical question.)

IMHO the status of Farringdon as a non-London Terminal is a ridiculous
anomaly that catches out large numbers of people who believe themselves
to be holding a valid ticket. It's ridiculous that with my particular
season ticket I can get off the train at City Thameslink or KXT (a good
deal further on than Farringdon and no more of a "terminal" under
non-blockade circumstances), but if I dare to get off at the station
between them I risk a £10 penalty fare. Grr.

IMHO the status of Farringdon as a non-London Terminal is a ridiculous
anomaly that catches out large numbers of people who believe themselves
to be holding a valid ticket. It's ridiculous that with my particular
season ticket I can get off the train at City Thameslink or KXT (a good
deal further on than Farringdon and no more of a "terminal" under
non-blockade circumstances), but if I dare to get off at the station
between them I risk a £10 penalty fare. Grr.

Kings Cross Thameslink is not a valid "London Terminal" for journeys
from the south.

From the Thameslink website:

http://www.travelbuddy.info/main.php...id=6&page_id=9

"Customers travelling to London from the south, including the Brighton
line and the Wimbledon – Sutton – Carshalton line, will continue to be
issued with tickets with the destination “London Terminals” if
travelling to London Bridge, Blackfriars or City Thameslink. Customers
travelling to Farringdon or King's Cross Thameslink from the south
will continue to receive tickets naming these specific stations."

Matthew Dickinson wrote in
:

Kings Cross Thameslink is not a valid "London Terminal" for journeys
from the south.

I agree with what you say, but when I asked for a ticket from East Dulwich
to KXT I was given one to London Terminals. This was in Sept 04. Has
something changed. Or was the staff member confused.


--
Andrew Black
andrewblack at despammed.com
London

In article , "Andrew
Black (delete obvious bit)" writes
I agree with what you say, but when I asked for a ticket from East Dulwich
to KXT I was given one to London Terminals. This was in Sept 04. Has
something changed. Or was the staff member confused.

I rather suspect that ticket office staff may be confused. On several
occasions I have bought a ticket from a south London terminal such as
Waterloo or Charing Cross to Luton, telling the clerk that I wanted a
ticket valid on NR trains from there to London Bridge, and then north
via Thameslink. I have mostly been sold a "London Terminals" to Luton
ticket at (I'm pretty sure) the same price as if I had bought one at,
say, King's Cross (but not Farringdon). I suspect these were sold to me
too cheaply, but I'm not sure.

There is obviously a distinction between north London terminals, and
south London ones as far as the fares go, but is such a distinction
visible on the ticket itself when it is printed?

--
Clive Page

Clive Page wrote:

There is obviously a distinction between north London terminals, and
south London ones as far as the fares go, but is such a distinction
visible on the ticket itself when it is printed?

It's in section K of the National Fares Manual.
--
Michael Hoffman

Michael Hoffman wrote:
Clive Page wrote:

There is obviously a distinction between north London terminals, and
south London ones as far as the fares go, but is such a distinction
visible on the ticket itself when it is printed?

It's in section K of the National Fares Manual.

Oops, I mean section A!
--
Michael Hoffman

On 25 Mar 2005 16:01:45 -0800, "Rupert Candy"
wrote:


Dave Arquati wrote:
Rupert Candy wrote:
In that case I suppose the Farringdon validators are actually
intended
for people changing *onto* Thameslink, having used Prepay to get
them
there on the Tube (since otherwise you would be leaving the Tube
without passing through a gateline). In fact I can't think of any
way
they could be used in the opposite direction (though I suppose
someone
might *theoretically* have e.g. a Brighton - Farringdon LU
season...)

Not really... you could have any National Rail ticket valid to
Farringdon (e.g. a single from Luton to Farringdon) and then you
would
touch in on the validators with an Oyster in order to continue your
journey on the Tube (e.g. to Whitechapel).

I suppose so, but I wonder how many people in e.g. Luton realise that
if they buy a ticket to "London" it won't be valid at Farringdon, so
they have to buy a ticket to "Farringdon LU"? In other words, how many
people would *correctly* use the validators for the journey you
describe? (Obviously a rhetorical question.)

IMHO the status of Farringdon as a non-London Terminal is a ridiculous
anomaly that catches out large numbers of people who believe themselves
to be holding a valid ticket. It's ridiculous that with my particular
season ticket I can get off the train at City Thameslink or KXT (a good
deal further on than Farringdon and no more of a "terminal" under
non-blockade circumstances), but if I dare to get off at the station
between them I risk a £10 penalty fare. Grr.

Actually this is a bit weird.
I have several clients about the Farringdon area and so did specify
Farringdon when going there pre-blockade. Still was inevitably given a
London Terminals ticket. Now just get a Travel Card so I can free up
my options.

In the last couple of months I have also had some surprises WRT
Farringdon KX travel. Returning in a group from an evening function at
Clerkenwell in very inclement weather we used TL to KX then walked
down the tunnels to KX underground for shelter, forgetting that that
would mean that we would hit the Northern barriers at the other end.
The TL tickets operated these with no problem.

Then at the next function we found the weather just as bad and used
the Circle line to return, expecting to pay extra at the barriers at
KX. Nope, ML tickets were accepted by them

Keith J Chesworth

www.unseenlondon.co.uk
www.blackpooltram.co.uk
www.happysnapper.com
www.boilerbill.com - main site
www.amerseyferry.co.uk

In article . com,
Rupert Candy writes
IMHO the status of Farringdon as a non-London Terminal is a ridiculous
anomaly that catches out large numbers of people who believe themselves
to be holding a valid ticket. It's ridiculous that with my particular
season ticket I can get off the train at City Thameslink or KXT (a good
deal further on than Farringdon and no more of a "terminal" under
non-blockade circumstances), but if I dare to get off at the station
between them I risk a £10 penalty fare. Grr.

I thought that *all* rail season tickets were automatically valid for
all combinations of stations on a valid route between the end points.
Can you explain what is special about your ticket that makes this not
true?


--
Clive Page