On Tue, 11 Oct 2005 07:53:27 GMT, "Graham J"
wrote:

It is evident from posts here, as well as from the very low level of
take up, that people simply do not understand what pre pay is and how it
works. The huge attachment to Travelcard and its relative ease of use is
obviously a factor in making it hard for people to understand how
pre-pay works alongside it or in the case of capping or extensions in
conjunction with it. TfL urgently need to get more information out to
actual and potential card holders as to how Oyster works - publicity has
been dumbed down too far.

I'd agree with that. I was at a tramstop in Croydon and there were some
young girls standing around talking and when one of them queried what the
Oyster validator was another replied that 'it was for old people'.

The validator concept is very difficult. We had to specify them because
they have to exist at the boundaries of the LU / TfL fare scale. You
can't ever gate every interchange point given the historical "design" of
so many of our stations. New systems design interchange between stored
value systems to work flawlessly - Hong Kong between the MTR and KCRC is
the key example. They have the advantage of always having had the
requirement to validate in and out of each system.

I am trying to remember if there has been a mailshot to everyones homes
talking about Oyster Pre-Pay. Every now and again bus maps and timetables
and area guides turn up but I can't recall a Pre-Pay one.

No but then the tickets book is readily available at stations and you
get it on the TfL website. While it has to be written for a mass market
it tries, but fails in my view, to deal with the complexities of
London's ticketing arrangements. A lot of the old system has necessarily
been "compromised" or watered down to make some things work. However
places like Wimbledon and London Bridge NR and their arcane validation
rules seem to be trying to more than compensate via their own
complexity.

My recent trip to Berlin uncovered a range of extremely detailed
booklets covering the Berlin regional fare system. As with many such
systems it is a complex structure but at least information is readily
available. Much of this was also covered in a superb Berlin Atlas that
shows all the transport routes overlaid on a very clear street atlas
complete with schematic diagrams and frequency guides for every bus,
tram and U Bahn line. First and last times are included together with
times between every stop and what routes you can interchange to at each
stop. Their stop specific information is also a model of clarity.
Please can we have this for London !!!!!!

I haven't bought a single on the bus or tube for ages. Is there any Oyster
publicity on them? It would be great if it were possible to print 'you
would have saved at least £x.xx on this ticket if you'd used Pre-Pay' on
them.

I'm not aware that there is any such information on tickets - most
people don't look at their tickets anyway. I think it is far more
important for good publicity to be provided alongside high quality
information being available for people to take away. I couldn't
understand the capping rules until I saw a series of worked examples at
work. Such examples really should be provided to customers so they can
understand how their journey variables (time, date, zone, validate or
not) relate to what they can end up paying. The average person doesn't
stand a chance of understanding whether they are being charged the right
fare.

When it comes to actually using Pre-Pay, something that does frustrate me is
the signs above tube and rail platform validators that say words to the
effect of "Pre-Pay users touch in here". That simply isn't good enough.
More information is needed. For example, at Farringdon Pre-Pay users who
will be entering and leaving the station through the gates may pass these
validators on the platforms and be tempted to use them. If they are
switching between tube and Thameslink they might pass one or two or them and
again use one or both of them. Maybe this is harmless but if isn't they
should be warned off. The signage should make it clear under what
circumstances a validation is needed. Similarly at Wimbledon there are
validators on the tube platforms but again no explanatory note to make it
clear when they are being used. For example someone arriving on the
District Line and switching to the tram might think that touching in on the
tram platform removes the need to have touched out on the tube platform or
touching out on the tube platform removed the need to touch in. It is also
incredibly easy to walk past the validators on the tube platform without
thinking.

I agree with all of the above but the problem is that the sign could end
up being 20 feet tall to deal with all of the possible journey / ticket
permutations that could arise. NR to / from LU / DLR permutations are
almost beyond comprehension because of the wide range of NR tickets. If
you then perm that with the range of possibilities of people holding
paper travelcards (from out of London) and also an Oyster for pre-pay
extensions then I can't see how you communicate clearly on a sign
without causing people to crowd by the validators and thus causing
congestions. It was mind bending when we did the initial design work to
define all of the interfaces - since then DLR and Tramlink have been
added in to system. The ticket range and the operation of pre-pay have
also changed considerably since the earliest assumptions so I imagine it
is even more complex now than in the "mind bending" days.

I do agree that many validators are "invisible" and that they need more
obvious locational signage when located on platforms or routeways.
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!