Adrian wrote:
Kev ) gurgled happily, sounding much like they were saying
:

Reversing is clearly hazardous even for a car driver.

Driving *forwards* is "clearly hazardous even for a car driver".

With proper observation, reversing is no more hazardous than that.
Except that the bus driver had already past a space that he could have
pulled into allowing me to move forwards rather than backwards.
If driving backwards was no more hazardous than driving forwards we
would drive backwards everywhere but I maintain that reversing on a
busy road at 6.55 am when it is still dark IS more hazardous than
driving forwards.

Kevin

mrcheerful . wrote:
"Kev" wrote in message
oups.com...

Had a run in with a nice employee of Arriva this morning who called me
a ****ing moron because I didn't know that PSV drivers aren't allowed
to reverse. Now I am not an expert on the law regarding PSV drivers so
can somebody confirm that it is a fact that they are not allowed to
reverse. Seems bonkers to me.
Whether thay can or can't reverse I take it that they can't call
members of the public ****ing morons or threaten to punch them in the
face.

Kevin


So, you have tried to get a bus to reverse to let you through? Presumably
you have told him to reverse? I am not surprised he told you your fortune.
The safety of a bus reversing manoeuvre on a crowded street is clearly not
good.

All bus drivers are told not to reverse except in the depot (unless with
helper, policeman or whatever)
I have always been aware of that, I would say it is common knowledge.

No-one should foul mouth anyone, but in a heated situation it is quite a
common occurrence and is better than getting thumped.

Let it go and move on, learning from the experience.


One thing that may cause misunderstanding is that a bus driver has to
make decisions far earlier than a car driver and has to brake earlier
and more gently. Having committed himself to driving past a gap between
cars, on the assumption that a car coming the other way will give way,
he cannot change the plan and pull in and stop as easily as a car - if
the oncoming car does the unexpected and continues on.

I would imagine that this was the situation. The bus driver reckoned
that the OP would give way and committed the bus to going past the gap.
When he realised that the OP was continuing on - it was already too late
for him to use the gap, even if he hadn't reached it yet.

That could have looked to the OP like the bus driver deliberately went
on past a gap - knowing that would cause a problem.

That could explain how the two vehicles ended up with both drivers
feeling agrieved at the other. And with the OP thinking that the bus
driver was "in the wrong" and should back up. And the driver being
annoyed at himself for reading the situation wrong and annoyed at the
driver for "being a pratt"...

It doesn't excuse the bus driver's reaction. But demanding that a bus
reverses isn't reasonable - however the bus arrived at that situation.

--
Sue

Kev wrote:
Adrian wrote:

Kev ) gurgled happily, sounding much like they were saying
:


Reversing is clearly hazardous even for a car driver.

Driving *forwards* is "clearly hazardous even for a car driver".

With proper observation, reversing is no more hazardous than that.

Except that the bus driver had already past a space that he could have
pulled into allowing me to move forwards rather than backwards.
If driving backwards was no more hazardous than driving forwards we
would drive backwards everywhere but I maintain that reversing on a
busy road at 6.55 am when it is still dark IS more hazardous than
driving forwards.


I don't, obviously, know the circumstances but suggest that the bus
driver was already committed to going past the space. Bus passengers
seldom use seat belts, can be standing, can have babies held in their
arms, are often children and the aged, etc. It is very, very dangerous
to bring a bus to a halt rapidly or even as gently as a car driver might
think of as a normal stop..

--
Sue

Palindr☻me wrote:
mrcheerful . wrote:
"Kev" wrote in message
oups.com...

Had a run in with a nice employee of Arriva this morning who called me
a ****ing moron because I didn't know that PSV drivers aren't allowed
to reverse. Now I am not an expert on the law regarding PSV drivers so
can somebody confirm that it is a fact that they are not allowed to
reverse. Seems bonkers to me.
Whether thay can or can't reverse I take it that they can't call
members of the public ****ing morons or threaten to punch them in the
face.

Kevin


So, you have tried to get a bus to reverse to let you through? Presumably
you have told him to reverse? I am not surprised he told you your fortune.
The safety of a bus reversing manoeuvre on a crowded street is clearly not
good.

All bus drivers are told not to reverse except in the depot (unless with
helper, policeman or whatever)
I have always been aware of that, I would say it is common knowledge.

No-one should foul mouth anyone, but in a heated situation it is quite a
common occurrence and is better than getting thumped.

Let it go and move on, learning from the experience.


One thing that may cause misunderstanding is that a bus driver has to
make decisions far earlier than a car driver and has to brake earlier
and more gently. Having committed himself to driving past a gap between
cars, on the assumption that a car coming the other way will give way,
he cannot change the plan and pull in and stop as easily as a car - if
the oncoming car does the unexpected and continues on.

I would imagine that this was the situation. The bus driver reckoned
that the OP would give way and committed the bus to going past the gap.
When he realised that the OP was continuing on - it was already too late
for him to use the gap, even if he hadn't reached it yet.

That could have looked to the OP like the bus driver deliberately went
on past a gap - knowing that would cause a problem.

That could explain how the two vehicles ended up with both drivers
feeling agrieved at the other. And with the OP thinking that the bus
driver was "in the wrong" and should back up. And the driver being
annoyed at himself for reading the situation wrong and annoyed at the
driver for "being a pratt"...

It doesn't excuse the bus driver's reaction. But demanding that a bus
reverses isn't reasonable - however the bus arrived at that situation.

--
Sue

Can I just clarify that at no time was the bus driver expected to
reverse. It is interesting though, had I told the bus driver he was
****ing moron and threatened violence our friendly police would have
arrested and charged me.

Kevin

"Kev" wrote in message
ps.com...

Palindr?me wrote:
mrcheerful . wrote:
"Kev" wrote in message
oups.com...

Had a run in with a nice employee of Arriva this morning who called me
a ****ing moron because I didn't know that PSV drivers aren't allowed
to reverse. Now I am not an expert on the law regarding PSV drivers so
can somebody confirm that it is a fact that they are not allowed to
reverse. Seems bonkers to me.
Whether thay can or can't reverse I take it that they can't call
members of the public ****ing morons or threaten to punch them in the
face.

Kevin


So, you have tried to get a bus to reverse to let you through?
Presumably
you have told him to reverse? I am not surprised he told you your
fortune.
The safety of a bus reversing manoeuvre on a crowded street is clearly
not
good.

All bus drivers are told not to reverse except in the depot (unless with
helper, policeman or whatever)
I have always been aware of that, I would say it is common knowledge.

No-one should foul mouth anyone, but in a heated situation it is quite a
common occurrence and is better than getting thumped.

Let it go and move on, learning from the experience.


One thing that may cause misunderstanding is that a bus driver has to
make decisions far earlier than a car driver and has to brake earlier
and more gently. Having committed himself to driving past a gap between
cars, on the assumption that a car coming the other way will give way,
he cannot change the plan and pull in and stop as easily as a car - if
the oncoming car does the unexpected and continues on.

I would imagine that this was the situation. The bus driver reckoned
that the OP would give way and committed the bus to going past the gap.
When he realised that the OP was continuing on - it was already too late
for him to use the gap, even if he hadn't reached it yet.

That could have looked to the OP like the bus driver deliberately went
on past a gap - knowing that would cause a problem.

That could explain how the two vehicles ended up with both drivers
feeling agrieved at the other. And with the OP thinking that the bus
driver was "in the wrong" and should back up. And the driver being
annoyed at himself for reading the situation wrong and annoyed at the
driver for "being a pratt"...

It doesn't excuse the bus driver's reaction. But demanding that a bus
reverses isn't reasonable - however the bus arrived at that situation.

--
Sue

Can I just clarify that at no time was the bus driver expected to
reverse. It is interesting though, had I told the bus driver he was
****ing moron and threatened violence our friendly police would have
arrested and charged me.

Kevin

This gap the driver went past. Do you realise how much room a bus needs to
get into a gap ? Maybe the driver judged that the gap was too small

Fray Bentos wrote:
snip
This gap the driver went past. Do you realise how much room a bus needs to
get into a gap ? Maybe the driver judged that the gap was too small

Often the problem isn't getting in - it is getting back out. A typical
bus has excellent lock but heck of a lot of bus after the back wheels.

If you have to put a lot of lock on to get out, the back sweeps quite a
nice path across the pavement.

--
Sue

On 7 Feb 2006 04:20:08 -0800, "Kev" wrote:


Alex Heney wrote:
On 7 Feb 2006 02:53:33 -0800, "Kev" wrote:


snip

The guy actually drove past a gap in parked cars that he could have
pulled into to allow me to proceed without the need to reverse myself.
Reversing is clearly hazardous even for a car driver.

Given the situation you now describe, if I had been that bus driver,
you would certainly have got a mouthful of abuse from me too.

I suppose I should have guessed the subtext, rather than just
answering the bald question as you put it.

And it is many times more dangerous for a large bus to reverse on the
public road than it is for a car to do so.

Unless you are a *really* crap car driver, of course.

I'm not surprised that driving a bus is stressful if you go around
telling other road users that they are ****ing morons.

It was clearly justified, but he still shouldn't have called you that.

I understand
that they are short of drivers but Arriva really dragging the barrel
getting their current drivers.


It isn't that surprising he lost his rag a bit when faced with a moron
like you.
--
Alex Heney, Global Villager
The young know the rules, the old know the exceptions.
To reply by email, my address is alexATheneyDOTplusDOTcom

So I am a moron for expecting a bus driver to pull into a space rather
than pulling up to my car bumper to bumper then getting so ****ed of
that I didn't reverse at high speed to allow him unhindered access then
to swear and threaten violence.

No.

You are a moron for not reversing once into that situation.

I obviously did not see the situation,. so I don't know whether I
really was reasonable for him to pull into the space.

But whether it was or not, for you to then suggest he should be the
one to reverse *is* moronic.

And you must have made such a suggestion for him to be telling you he
is not allowed to.

Well al least we all now know that you support violence and aggression
and fowl language rather than do what is expected.

How on earth do you "know" that falsehood?


If you see another car coming the other way do you also deliberately
drive past a space then tell the other driver he is a ****ing moron and
threaten to punch him in the face.
You don't have to answer that.

Of course I don't. And I would be amazed if what actually happened
was even close to being as simple as you paint it.

But if I was driving something several times as large as the other
vehicle, with seriously restricted rearward visibility, and had got
into a situation (whether by my mistake or his), then I would expect
the other vehicle to be the one who reverses.
--
Alex Heney, Global Villager
I tried to daydream, but my mind kept wandering.
To reply by email, my address is alexATheneyDOTplusDOTcom

On 7 Feb 2006 04:51:56 -0800, "Kev" wrote:

snip


Can I just clarify that at no time was the bus driver expected to
reverse.

So how was he in a situation to be complaining at you for expecting
him to?

Are you saying that after you reversed without any prompting, he
pulled up alongside you and stopped to abuse and threaten you?

If that is what you are saying, then his conduct is inexcusable.

But frankly, I don't believe you. You must have done or said something
that indicated to him that you expected him to reverse, even if it was
just waiting until he complained


It is interesting though, had I told the bus driver he was
****ing moron and threatened violence our friendly police would have
arrested and charged me.


So why didn't the policeman present do that to the bus driver? Unless,
of course, he thought you deserved it (in which case things cannot be
as simple as you suggest).

Or are you suggesting that one would miraculously have appeared if you
had been the one complaining and threatening?
--
Alex Heney, Global Villager
Truck Pulls: for people who cannot understand the WWF
To reply by email, my address is alexATheneyDOTplusDOTcom

All it takes is a little courtesy, whoever may or may not be in the
right or wrong. There may have been an error of judgement on the part
of either driver. Common sense and courtesy says that the smaller,
more manoeuvrable vehicle should reverse/give way (subject to other
traffic behind). After that, a simple smile and "sorry" can work
wonders.

PhilD

--

Alex Heney wrote:
On 7 Feb 2006 04:20:08 -0800, "Kev" wrote:


You are a moron for not reversing once into that situation.

Who said that I didn't reverse once into the situation. I drive around
a bend in the road and I am confronted by a small bus heding towards me
wrong side of the road passing parked cars. I immediately stop along
side a parked car to my RH side. The bus passes a large space, that he
could have pulled into had he chosen to do so, to face me bumper to
bumper.
I have to make sure that the road behind is clear, it is dark and I
reverse up, the engine has stalled so I have to restart the engine
before doing so.The drivers reponse is, ****ing moron don't you know a
psv driver can't reverse. Well actually I didn't know and quite frankly
I don't give a damn that I don't know.

I obviously did not see the situation,. so I don't know whether I
really was reasonable for him to pull into the space.

Take my word for it, this was a large enough space for him to pull
into. Do not forget that it was dark so he would have seen my lights
from around the corner. I saw his lights and stopped but was already
along side parked cars.

But whether it was or not, for you to then suggest he should be the
one to reverse *is* moronic.

I haven't at any time suggested that he reversed. Please refer to any
text that suggested that I said that.

And you must have made such a suggestion for him to be telling you he
is not allowed to.

I said nothing to him, his outburst was unprovoked

How on earth do you "know" that falsehood?


Don't understand, what falsehood.

Of course I don't. And I would be amazed if what actually happened
was even close to being as simple as you paint it.

But if I was driving something several times as large as the other
vehicle, with seriously restricted rearward visibility, and had got
into a situation (whether by my mistake or his), then I would expect
the other vehicle to be the one who reverses.

Which is what happened so why was it necessary to swear and threaten
violence but then some people are mentally deranged and jumped to
violence at the slightest provocation but then you indicated in the
same situation you would have reacted as the bus driver did.

Are you in the habit of telling people they are ****ing morons if they
happen to get in your way or do you just whack them one without the
insult.

Kevin