TKD wrote:
I would imagine stations that already have barriers with Oyster readers
in
place, that are currently only used for season ticket validation, would
be
first. I wonder if they will let these stations go-live before the
equipment has been installed at the intermediate stations.
Its difficult to see how PAYG could work if some stations on the route
don't have readers - it would be a recipe for unresolved journeys.

It happens now with Liverpool Street - Walthamstow Central/Tottenham
Hale/Seven Sisters. It depends if they want to go for some quick-wins like
Victoria-Balham, Victoria-Bromley South or Victoria/London Bridge-East
Croydon. I find it hard to believe Ken would resist the PR opportunity to
go-live on the gated stations early. The press release says work will start
on them first. Will the technology be installed and then left idle while
the other stations have gates installed?

The technology will probably be used, but initially only to issue season
tickets on Oyster - TfL will be providing the appropriate back-office
equipment for station ticket offices.

--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7
www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London

If barriers are going to be placed at all N.R. stations, what is going
to happen at stations, like Wandsworth Town, where the ticket office is
on the island platform, on the trainside of any likely barrier
position?

Marc.

In message .com,
" writes

If barriers are going to be placed at all N.R. stations,

I don't think there's any proposal for barriers at all NR stations -
just Oyster validators.

--
Paul Terry

Paul Terry wrote:
In message .com,
" writes

If barriers are going to be placed at all N.R. stations,

I don't think there's any proposal for barriers at all NR stations -
just Oyster validators.


I wonder if there is any way of making it more obvious to casual
travellers that when they arrive at a station by train they need to
search for a validator on the platform?

I arrived at New Cross Gate for the first time the other day, using the
East London Line, and having touched in with my pre-pay Oyster at a
tube station. There were crowds of people on the platform so I couldn't
have seen the platform validators even if I had thought of looking for
them. Though even if I had noticed them I would probably have thought
that they were intended only for people changing between Tube and NR at
that station.

As it was I assumed that since New Cross Gate was a big station there
would be exit gates and so I followed the crowds up the stairs and
along the passageway to the main concourse. I then discovered that
there were no gates or validators there. Rather than walk all the way
back to the platforms I decided to leave the station leaving an
unresolved journey on my Oyster.

Now I know that unresolved journeys are straightforward to fix at the
moment, but shouldn't LU/TfL do something to make it easier to know
when you need to look for and use a platform validator?

PaulO

On 10 May 2006 09:41:22 -0700, "
wrote:


If barriers are going to be placed at all N.R. stations, what is going
to happen at stations, like Wandsworth Town, where the ticket office is
on the island platform, on the trainside of any likely barrier
position?

No one has said everywhere is getting gated. Validation equipment is
required and it will be to the same design as used on some NR stations
north of Queens Park or on the DLR.

You still need a local network to provide the necessary info to and from
the devices and to support whatever retailing infrastructure is going to
be provided.

I'm just pleased to see some sort of progress at last. I'm curious to
know what strong arm tactics have been employed to get this deal
through.
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

If barriers are going to be placed at all N.R. stations, what is going
to happen at stations, like Wandsworth Town, where the ticket office is
on the island platform, on the trainside of any likely barrier
position?

No one has said everywhere is getting gated. Validation equipment is
required and it will be to the same design as used on some NR stations
north of Queens Park or on the DLR.

You still need a local network to provide the necessary info to and from
the devices and to support whatever retailing infrastructure is going to
be provided.

I'm just pleased to see some sort of progress at last. I'm curious to
know what strong arm tactics have been employed to get this deal
through.

According to a report on BBC London News the TOCs are not happy as they
were not consulted about the TfL/DfT deal.

On Wed, 10 May 2006 18:42:29 +0100, "TKD" wrote:

If barriers are going to be placed at all N.R. stations, what is going
to happen at stations, like Wandsworth Town, where the ticket office is
on the island platform, on the trainside of any likely barrier
position?

No one has said everywhere is getting gated. Validation equipment is
required and it will be to the same design as used on some NR stations
north of Queens Park or on the DLR.

You still need a local network to provide the necessary info to and from
the devices and to support whatever retailing infrastructure is going to
be provided.

I'm just pleased to see some sort of progress at last. I'm curious to
know what strong arm tactics have been employed to get this deal
through.

According to a report on BBC London News the TOCs are not happy as they
were not consulted about the TfL/DfT deal.

Tough - they have prevaricated for over 7 years on this. The DfT will
simply tell them what to do and I trust they are sensible enough to
simply get on and do it. My guess is that if they are not then the DfT
will be minded to give TfL ever greater influence / control over
services in or around London and the TOCs *really* will not like that!
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

"Paul Corfield" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 10 May 2006 18:42:29 +0100, "TKD" wrote:

If barriers are going to be placed at all N.R. stations, what is going
to happen at stations, like Wandsworth Town, where the ticket office is
on the island platform, on the trainside of any likely barrier
position?

No one has said everywhere is getting gated. Validation equipment is
required and it will be to the same design as used on some NR stations
north of Queens Park or on the DLR.

You still need a local network to provide the necessary info to and from
the devices and to support whatever retailing infrastructure is going to
be provided.

I'm just pleased to see some sort of progress at last. I'm curious to
know what strong arm tactics have been employed to get this deal
through.

According to a report on BBC London News the TOCs are not happy as they
were not consulted about the TfL/DfT deal.

Tough - they have prevaricated for over 7 years on this. The DfT will
simply tell them what to do and I trust they are sensible enough to
simply get on and do it. My guess is that if they are not then the DfT
will be minded to give TfL ever greater influence / control over
services in or around London and the TOCs *really* will not like that!
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

The TOC's don't want this because it is one step away from destroying their
fare structure for single / return tickets. Obviously TfL would like to
impose the same structure as on the Tube.

Until the franchises are renewed (as in the case of SWT) and the use of
Oyster within the zones is mandated, I think that the prevarication may
continue

In message , Paul Corfield
writes

I'm just pleased to see some sort of progress at last. I'm curious to
know what strong arm tactics have been employed to get this deal
through.

A film clip on the news last night had Ken claiming that failure to
co-operate with Oyster would result in franchises not being renewed -
although quite what clout he has to back that up is not entirely clear
to me.

On a slightly different tack, there is one part of this little saga that
has received little attention in the press:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/05...tcard_shelved/

(TfL abandons plans to add e-payments for parking and goods to Oyster).

I wonder if that was a sweetener to help get the TOCs onside?
--
Paul Terry

Paul Terry wrote:
In message , Paul Corfield
writes

I'm just pleased to see some sort of progress at last. I'm curious to
know what strong arm tactics have been employed to get this deal
through.

A film clip on the news last night had Ken claiming that failure to
co-operate with Oyster would result in franchises not being renewed -
although quite what clout he has to back that up is not entirely clear
to me.

The deal involved the DfT so they are presumably willing to exercise
their powers to move things along.

On a slightly different tack, there is one part of this little saga that
has received little attention in the press:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/05...tcard_shelved/

(TfL abandons plans to add e-payments for parking and goods to Oyster).

I wonder if that was a sweetener to help get the TOCs onside?

Would that have really bothered the TOCs?

--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7
www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London