On my Oyster I have a Zone 1-2 annual travelcard for the commute from
my home to my regular office. Currently I'm working offsite in
Feltham, though, so in addition to that I have a Zone 3-6 monthly
travelcard.

This morning, on the train from Waterloo to Feltham, an especially
surly ticket inspector asked to see tickets. I gave my Oystercard, the
light on the little machine went green, all fine. Or so I thought.
The inspector asked where I was travelling to, and I replied, Feltham.
He then said, loudly and aggressively, "you only have Zones 1 & 2 on
that Oyster so your ticket isn't valid to Feltham". I told him that
there was also a Zone 3-6 monthly travelcard on it as well. He replied
that no there wasn't, only Zones 1 & 2, and said that I would have to
leave the train at Clapham Junction as my ticket wasn't valid to
Feltham. So I had to get out the paper receipt to show him! After
extended scrutiny, he grunted and accepted that I had a valid ticket as
far as Feltham; needless to state no apology for the public
humiliation, or explanation why his machine hadn't been able to read
it. Of course the Oyster card worked fine on the gates at Feltham, as
it has done every day since I got it.

So what's the problem with those little machines? Are they simply not
sophisticated enough to read more than the main ticket on an Oyster
card?

Patrick

wrote:

On my Oyster I have a Zone 1-2 annual travelcard for the commute from
my home to my regular office. Currently I'm working offsite in
Feltham, though, so in addition to that I have a Zone 3-6 monthly
travelcard.

This morning, on the train from Waterloo to Feltham, an especially
surly ticket inspector asked to see tickets. I gave my Oystercard,
the light on the little machine went green, all fine. Or so I
thought. The inspector asked where I was travelling to, and I
replied, Feltham. He then said, loudly and aggressively, "you only
have Zones 1 & 2 on that Oyster so your ticket isn't valid to
Feltham". I told him that there was also a Zone 3-6 monthly
travelcard on it as well. He replied that no there wasn't, only
Zones 1 & 2, and said that I would have to leave the train at Clapham
Junction as my ticket wasn't valid to Feltham. So I had to get out
the paper receipt to show him! After extended scrutiny, he grunted
and accepted that I had a valid ticket as far as Feltham; needless to
state no apology for the public humiliation, or explanation why his
machine hadn't been able to read it. Of course the Oyster card
worked fine on the gates at Feltham, as it has done every day since I
got it.

So what's the problem with those little machines? Are they simply not
sophisticated enough to read more than the main ticket on an Oyster
card?


I suspect that it was the attached person that wasn't sophisticated
enough.


--
Bob

It would make sense about it being a training issue; he was pretty
insistent that it was only a Zone 1 & 2, though. I guess what annoyed
me most was the implicit accusation that OF COURSE I would be fare
dodging. First the aggressive way the ticket was asked for, then the
demand to know where I was travelling to, even though the train was
between Waterloo & Clapham Junction at the time, so my Zone 1 & 2 was
valid! Then the over-the-top, and very demeaning, insistence that I
didn't have the ticket that I knew I did have. And then no apology at
the end when I did have the correct ticket after all.

wrote:
It would make sense about it being a training issue; he was pretty
insistent that it was only a Zone 1 & 2, though. I guess what
annoyed me most was the implicit accusation that OF COURSE I would
be fare dodging. First the aggressive way the ticket was asked
for, then the demand to know where I was travelling to, even though
the train was between Waterloo & Clapham Junction at the time, so
my Zone 1 & 2 was valid! Then the over-the-top, and very
demeaning, insistence that I didn't have the ticket that I knew I
did have. And then no apology at the end when I did have the
correct ticket after all.

The complaint form for South West Trains is at
http://www.southwesttrains.co.uk/SWT...ntact+form.htm

--
Richard J.
(to e-mail me, swap uk and yon in address)

In message of Fri, 26
May 2006 10:48:55 in uk.transport.london, Richard J.
writes
wrote:
It would make sense about it being a training issue; he was pretty
insistent that it was only a Zone 1 & 2, though. I guess what
annoyed me most was the implicit accusation that OF COURSE I would
be fare dodging. First the aggressive way the ticket was asked
for, then the demand to know where I was travelling to, even though
the train was between Waterloo & Clapham Junction at the time, so
my Zone 1 & 2 was valid! Then the over-the-top, and very
demeaning, insistence that I didn't have the ticket that I knew I
did have. And then no apology at the end when I did have the
correct ticket after all.

The complaint form for South West Trains is at
http://www.southwesttrains.co.uk/SWT...ntact+form.htm


PLEASE make the complaint. It would be better made with the ID of the
bully but his employer should be able to identify him from your
information. I assume such people are too expensive to employ and, once
they acquire several complaints, will each get a P45.
One such complaint might persuade him to keep a civil tongue.
I look forward to a report of the response from SWT.
--
Walter Briscoe

On Fri, 26 May 2006 13:47:03 +0100, Walter Briscoe
said:

I look forward to a report of the response from SWT.

I predict that the response will be "thankyou for telling us about
this. We value your custom. Here's a worthless voucher that's not
valid for any journey you'll want to make. And we've now thrown your
complaint in the bin".

--
David Cantrell | http://www.cantrell.org.uk/david

David Cantrell wrote:

On Fri, 26 May 2006 13:47:03 +0100, Walter Briscoe
said:

I look forward to a report of the response from SWT.

I predict that the response will be "thankyou for telling us about
this. We value your custom. Here's a worthless voucher that's not
valid for any journey you'll want to make. And we've now thrown your
complaint in the bin".



SWT definitely has training issues with regard to travelcards. I was
travelling from Richmond to Twickenham on a one-day all zones
travelcard, which I had stuck in my season ticket wallet. The guard
insisted on me taking it out, which I couldn't understand the reason
for, and then he crossed through it with his pen.

I asked why he did that when it was a travelcard, and he said that it
could only be used on one return trip on that line. I said again that
it was a travelcard and I could use it as much as I liked, and he
responded on the usual "telling me my job" lines.

I took his name and complained to SWT that he might potentially issue
penalty fares or, more likely, trick people into thinking that they had
to buy another ticket.

Got a bland apology, but why do they have problems like this over such
a simple thing that has been around for years? Could it be because
they make fraudulent money out of it?

On 27 May 2006 12:16:13 -0700, "MIG"
wrote:


David Cantrell wrote:

On Fri, 26 May 2006 13:47:03 +0100, Walter Briscoe
said:

I look forward to a report of the response from SWT.

I predict that the response will be "thankyou for telling us about
this. We value your custom. Here's a worthless voucher that's not
valid for any journey you'll want to make. And we've now thrown your
complaint in the bin".



SWT definitely has training issues with regard to travelcards. I was
travelling from Richmond to Twickenham on a one-day all zones
travelcard, which I had stuck in my season ticket wallet. The guard
insisted on me taking it out, which I couldn't understand the reason
for, and then he crossed through it with his pen.

Travelcard tickets should never be defaced in that way. You run the risk
of further problems on other modes if a visual inspection is undertaken.
That sort of nonsense is almost as bad as using hole punches and then
punching through the magnetic stripe.

I asked why he did that when it was a travelcard, and he said that it
could only be used on one return trip on that line. I said again that
it was a travelcard and I could use it as much as I liked, and he
responded on the usual "telling me my job" lines.

Sounds like someone needs to tell about him the absolute basics of his
job like what a ticket is, what a validity is and a reminder to check
where he is when he undertakes a check.

I took his name and complained to SWT that he might potentially issue
penalty fares or, more likely, trick people into thinking that they had
to buy another ticket.

Or cause an unnecessary row, upset passengers and cause complaints to be
sent to the company that employs him.

Got a bland apology, but why do they have problems like this over such
a simple thing that has been around for years? Could it be because
they make fraudulent money out of it?

I suspect the reason is that it costs money to train people properly to
do what is a complex job. The sheet complexity of products and
validities is not only a problem for the fare paying public but also all
those employed to sell and check tickets.

There may be a fraudulent aspect but I would say the likelihood is very
small indeed - far more likely to be ignorance.

--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

Paul Corfield wrote:
On 27 May 2006 12:16:13 -0700, "MIG"
wrote:


David Cantrell wrote:

On Fri, 26 May 2006 13:47:03 +0100, Walter Briscoe
said:

I look forward to a report of the response from SWT.

I predict that the response will be "thankyou for telling us about
this. We value your custom. Here's a worthless voucher that's not
valid for any journey you'll want to make. And we've now thrown your
complaint in the bin".



SWT definitely has training issues with regard to travelcards. I was
travelling from Richmond to Twickenham on a one-day all zones
travelcard, which I had stuck in my season ticket wallet. The guard
insisted on me taking it out, which I couldn't understand the reason
for, and then he crossed through it with his pen.

Travelcard tickets should never be defaced in that way. You run the risk
of further problems on other modes if a visual inspection is undertaken.
That sort of nonsense is almost as bad as using hole punches and then
punching through the magnetic stripe.

I asked why he did that when it was a travelcard, and he said that it
could only be used on one return trip on that line. I said again that
it was a travelcard and I could use it as much as I liked, and he
responded on the usual "telling me my job" lines.

Sounds like someone needs to tell about him the absolute basics of his
job like what a ticket is, what a validity is and a reminder to check
where he is when he undertakes a check.

I took his name and complained to SWT that he might potentially issue
penalty fares or, more likely, trick people into thinking that they had
to buy another ticket.

Or cause an unnecessary row, upset passengers and cause complaints to be
sent to the company that employs him.

Got a bland apology, but why do they have problems like this over such
a simple thing that has been around for years? Could it be because
they make fraudulent money out of it?

I suspect the reason is that it costs money to train people properly to
do what is a complex job. The sheet complexity of products and
validities is not only a problem for the fare paying public but also all
those employed to sell and check tickets.

There may be a fraudulent aspect but I would say the likelihood is very
small indeed - far more likely to be ignorance.



Probably right, but paper one-day travelcards have been around for
years and are about the simplest ticket there is. In the story that is
the real subject of this thread, it's a new machine, but the problem
again is travelcards. Almost as if SWT leaves travelcards out of the
training.

David Cantrell wrote:
On Fri, 26 May 2006 13:47:03 +0100, Walter Briscoe
said:

I look forward to a report of the response from SWT.

I predict that the response will be "thankyou for telling us about
this. We value your custom. Here's a worthless voucher that's not
valid for any journey you'll want to make. And we've now thrown your
complaint in the bin".

--
David Cantrell | http://www.cantrell.org.uk/david


If you're not satisfied with what SWT says then appeal to London
Travelwatch (the renamed LTUC). They do make things happen, and they
collate information so if this is happening elsewhere as well they'll
bang all the London TOCs heads together and get them to sort it out.

http://www.londontravelwatch.org.uk/complaints.php

Calling it an appeal sounds complicated but all you need to do is send
them your original letter to SWT, their response and a one or two line
letter saying you don't think SWT's comeback is good enough. (Apols if
I've just stated the patronisingly obvious!)