Rich Mackin wrote:
"Paul Ebbens" wrote in message
...

"Mark B" wrote in message
...
Paul G wrote:

I thought TOC's were free to call themselves what they like - without
having to seek approval from Ken...

Do wonder if he'd rather have the trains painted in London Rail
Brown/Orange with roundels... First Neon City or London Turd?*

*which would probably spread to all trains serving the capital, like all
buses operating services classed as London must be red...


I thought Thameslink was around before branding? or did the King's Cross
TL station only appear after franchising?

Nope, the route was branded 'Thameslink', including all the same stations as
they are today, by NSE from opening in May 1987.



Very sensitive about the name of the Franchise are First. People
leaving FGW to go work there commonly refer to it as "Going to work for
Barclaycard" (name sounds like a credit card). One person overheard
saying this was taken aside and "advised".
More power to Kens elbow I say.

Very sensitive about the name of the Franchise are First.

I don't know why so, the lack of a distinguished brand and plastering
of "National Express" all over their bus & rail operations, along with
the same for Stagecoach's rail operations & certain bus operations
(MagicBus/MegaBus/et al.) hasn't really harmed the companies' share
prices, has it?

In uk.railway Joe Patrick wrote:
I don't know why so, the lack of a distinguished brand and plastering
of "National Express" all over their bus & rail operations, along with
the same for Stagecoach's rail operations & certain bus operations
(MagicBus/MegaBus/et al.) hasn't really harmed the companies' share
prices, has it?

Stagecoach seem to be a bit confused about this one. They used to heavily
brand 'Stagecoach SWT' but have dropped the 'Stagecoach' bit, but it's very
definitely 'Stagecoach Island Line'. Any ideas why?

Theo

Theo Markettos wrote:
In uk.railway Joe Patrick wrote:
I don't know why so, the lack of a distinguished brand and plastering
of "National Express" all over their bus & rail operations, along with
the same for Stagecoach's rail operations & certain bus operations
(MagicBus/MegaBus/et al.) hasn't really harmed the companies' share
prices, has it?

Stagecoach seem to be a bit confused about this one. They used to heavily
brand 'Stagecoach SWT' but have dropped the 'Stagecoach' bit, but it's very
definitely 'Stagecoach Island Line'. Any ideas why?

Theo


Virgin is much into branding though. The London and the South East
diagram goes along with this to the extent of having only one colour
for Virgin, even though there are two different franchises covered. I
think the others are all one colour per franchise.

MIG wrote:

Virgin is much into branding though.

Not as much as FirstGroup, perhaps surprisingly. The relative lack of
branding on the Voyagers (only on the outer ends) and Pendolinos (outer
ends and frosted on the doors) is noticeable and pleasant compared with
the F-in-circle appearing everywhere on anything to do with First.

IMO, the way First overbrand makes them look shoddy and unprofessional.
They'd do better to go lower-key.

Neil

On 4 Jul 2006 13:58:33 -0700 someone who may be "Neil Williams"
wrote this:-

IMO, the way First overbrand makes them look shoddy and unprofessional.
They'd do better to go lower-key.

Indeed. In Scotland National Express were very low key, simply
saying in a few places that the company was part of the National
Express Group. Then Last came along and stuck their "F" on
everything they can, as well as painting the trains pink. Given the
state of some of their buses in Edinburgh I doubt if this approach
has done the group any good. It has probably done the railways a
little damage, though not much.


--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

In message .com, at
13:58:33 on Tue, 4 Jul 2006, Neil Williams
remarked:
IMO, the way First overbrand makes them look shoddy and unprofessional.

I took a party to York at the weekend, and they commented on how
confusing it was to have five different (First-operated) Park-and-ride
routes, all using identical looking buses. In other towns you have buses
which are coloured to go along with the routes (Green, White, Red etc).

The buses use different bus stops (for each colour), and they are not
very easy to find; so being able to spot the relevant bus at a distance
and "chase" it would be very useful.
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry wrote:
In message .com, at
13:58:33 on Tue, 4 Jul 2006, Neil Williams
remarked:
IMO, the way First overbrand makes them look shoddy and unprofessional.

I took a party to York at the weekend, and they commented on how
confusing it was to have five different (First-operated) Park-and-ride
routes, all using identical looking buses. In other towns you have buses
which are coloured to go along with the routes (Green, White, Red etc).

The buses use different bus stops (for each colour), and they are not
very easy to find; so being able to spot the relevant bus at a distance
and "chase" it would be very useful.
--
Roland Perry


I wonder if that's a branding issue though? More likely they've got a
bus garage with one fleet of buses in it which they put on the routes
that they operate. It would be very restrictive to paint them
according to a specific route, and very confusing when they inevitably
had to use them on the wrong route.

London famously always got by with one colour of bus (and each bus from
a particular garage likely to turn up on any route operated by that
garage).

Roland Perry wrote:
In message .com, at
13:58:33 on Tue, 4 Jul 2006, Neil Williams remarked:
IMO, the way First overbrand makes them look shoddy and unprofessional.

I took a party to York at the weekend, and they commented on how
confusing it was to have five different (First-operated) Park-and-ride
routes, all using identical looking buses. In other towns you have buses
which are coloured to go along with the routes (Green, White, Red etc).

The buses use different bus stops (for each colour), and they are not
very easy to find; so being able to spot the relevant bus at a distance
and "chase" it would be very useful.

The Exeter ones are all yellow and blue.. - though each carries a
largeish Sowton/Honiton Road/Matford name

In uk.railway Roland Perry wrote:

: I took a party to York at the weekend, and they commented on how
: confusing it was to have five different (First-operated) Park-and-ride
: routes, all using identical looking buses. In other towns you have buses
: which are coloured to go along with the routes (Green, White, Red etc).

Most P&R schemes seem to be paid for by local authorities; York's is
run without any real subsidy which is why the livery is so First-like.

It would be almost impossible to keep 5 small fleets of different buses
in service anyway, without lots of spare vehicles. The generic P&R
livery gives some advertising advantage without confusing people if a
non-P&R bus turns up.

Geoff
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Given a choice, I would probably Geoff Short
choose the life of a hobbit"
- Mithrilian