On Fri, 07 Jul 2006 12:38:32 +0100, congokid wrote:

In article na.org.au,
Matthew Geier writes

between stations on at least some of the older trains on the Cityrail
system. This year the trains I travelled on there appeared to be newer
and had air conditioning.

Nope. Probably only 2/3 of the fleet is actually air conditioned. All are
power doors though.
If it has opening windows it isn't air conditioned. There is no provision
for opening the windows on Air conditioned stock.

One thing I have noticed, and I could be imaging things (or just getting
older :-), is that as the proportion of trains with air-conditioning has
been increasing, the Sydney city tunnels are getting hotter.
Presumably with each train dumping several kw extra of waste heat into
the tunnels it's raising the average temperature.

It's probably no so much an issue with the Sub-Surface lines with their
larger tunnels and frequent 'smoke vents', but I could see this being a
serious issue with the deep tube trains - if you fit air conditioning to
any new build rolling stock, just where is the AC system going to dump
it's waste heat ?. The tubes are already too hot. A serious amount of
civil engineering would be needed to improve air-flows through the tubes
to carry the waste heat off. (And probably electrical works to increase
the capacity of the traction power network to take the extra electrical
load of the air conditioning plant on each train).

The tube tunnels themselves need some sort of cooling system fitted
before even thinking about the trains.
I seem to recall somewhere that pumping chilled water through pipes
buried in the platform has been tried at at least one LU station.

On Sat, 08 Jul 2006 09:42:34 +1000 someone who may be Matthew Geier
wrote this:-

It's probably no so much an issue with the Sub-Surface lines with their
larger tunnels and frequent 'smoke vents', but I could see this being a
serious issue with the deep tube trains - if you fit air conditioning to
any new build rolling stock, just where is the AC system going to dump
it's waste heat ?. The tubes are already too hot. A serious amount of
civil engineering would be needed to improve air-flows through the tubes
to carry the waste heat off. (And probably electrical works to increase
the capacity of the traction power network to take the extra electrical
load of the air conditioning plant on each train).

One of the reasons that rubber tyres have not replaced steel ones,
as the proponents of the Paris Metro confidently predicted, is that
the rubber wheels give off a lot of heat, which has to be dealt with
in some way including beefing up ventilation and air-conditioning.


--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

David Hansen wrote:

Some photographs of the old electric trains on Tyneside appear to
show them moving with open sliding doors. I don't know if my eyes
are deceiving me though.



Yes, they did have manual sliding doors. When I lived in the North
East, one particular colleague (now retired) recalled how, in those
days, he would relieve himself in an open doorway while the train was
moving! (Apparently it was common practice on late-night trains!)

Steve M wrote:
Dave Arquati wrote:
Neil Williams wrote:

Edward Cowling London UK wrote:

The stress of not being able to get home will far outweigh the
stress of
being a bit hot, so get Ken off his latest hobby horse and leave the
Underground running.


Indeed.

I could go on about the new improved London Transport that Ken promised
us would be bought with the congestion charge money, but I think he's
spent it all on community policing and the damn Olympics.


A lot of it's gone on the bus network, to pretty good effect. The
trouble is it was a little too successful, in that it did redirect
people onto public transport, which means his income dropped. That
lead to the price rise and the "make it easier to pay" stuff to
encourage a few more people to drive and up the income again!


Talking of buses and heatwaves, I noticed on a 14 yesterday that a new
air cooling unit had been installed above the stairs on the top deck -
and very welcome it was too.



Interesting... I've seen a few of the 85s have these too (probably the
same fleet from Putney depot mind) and have wondered just how effective
the system is. Did you try sitting in different places to test the effect?

No... at the time I was far too hot for that, so I sat in the breeze
directly behind the cooler!


--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7
www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London

asdf wrote:
On 05 Jul 2006 07:19:57 GMT, Adrian wrote:

Ummm, lemme guess... No buffets on tube trains?
Pullman cars Mayflower and Galatea ran on the Met between 1910 and 1939.
Not quite tube trains in any sense.
The Met is certainly a tube line.

It's not a tube line, though it is a Tube line.

;-)

I find that distinction very useful when I'm trying to avoid
misinterpretation. LU also always capitalise "Tube" when they're talking
about themselves.

--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7
www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London

In article . com,
says...
Adrian wrote:

I'll bet that if you went to the buffet car on an intercity and asked for a
glass of tap water you'd get one for free.

No, because they don't carry any in a drinkable form. I recall a
notice being displayed quite prominently saying (mainly to parents with
babies) that they couldn't supply tap water because it was not
drinkable, as the buffet cars didn't have the correct infrastructure.

Adelantes certainly carry drinking water, as there is normally a stack
of the water cooler type bottles by the door from First Class into Coach
E. Not sure if the FGW HSTs are also equipped?

Duncan

victormeldrewsyoungerbrother wrote:
jonmorris wrote:

Of course, a 500ml bottle of water costs 50p in med countries, £2 in
London.

I thought the shops at Kings Cross were expensive, but I still only
pay 95p for a bottle, or £1.20 for two bottles. Not cheap, but not a
major rip off either. However, I don't care because whenever
possible I simply refill a bottle with (cold) water from our office
water machine, or before I leave in the morning! Sod expensive
mineral water!

Jonathan


Doesn't anyone here ever go in a supermarket? A six pack of 500ml
mineral waters costs about £2 (supermarket own brand). Buying in bulk
reduces the price. Morrisons have an offer currently on, I think,
Volvic in 5litre bottles for about the same price - not that I'm
suggesting you take a 5l bottle to work, just refill a smaller one.

Only fools BUY water! And plenty of firms bank on it - e.g. CocaCola and
their scam....!

Davebt wrote:
victormeldrewsyoungerbrother wrote:
jonmorris wrote:

Of course, a 500ml bottle of water costs 50p in med countries, £2 in
London.
I thought the shops at Kings Cross were expensive, but I still only
pay 95p for a bottle, or £1.20 for two bottles. Not cheap, but not a
major rip off either. However, I don't care because whenever
possible I simply refill a bottle with (cold) water from our office
water machine, or before I leave in the morning! Sod expensive
mineral water!

Jonathan

Doesn't anyone here ever go in a supermarket? A six pack of 500ml
mineral waters costs about £2 (supermarket own brand). Buying in bulk
reduces the price. Morrisons have an offer currently on, I think,
Volvic in 5litre bottles for about the same price - not that I'm
suggesting you take a 5l bottle to work, just refill a smaller one.

Only fools BUY water!

Next time the utility bill comes in the post you'll be reminded quite
otherwise.

"Andrew" wrote in message
k...
Davebt wrote:
victormeldrewsyoungerbrother wrote:
jonmorris wrote:

Of course, a 500ml bottle of water costs 50p in med countries, £2 in
London.
I thought the shops at Kings Cross were expensive, but I still only
pay 95p for a bottle, or £1.20 for two bottles. Not cheap, but not a
major rip off either. However, I don't care because whenever
possible I simply refill a bottle with (cold) water from our office
water machine, or before I leave in the morning! Sod expensive
mineral water!

Jonathan

Doesn't anyone here ever go in a supermarket? A six pack of 500ml
mineral waters costs about £2 (supermarket own brand). Buying in bulk
reduces the price. Morrisons have an offer currently on, I think,
Volvic in 5litre bottles for about the same price - not that I'm
suggesting you take a 5l bottle to work, just refill a smaller one.

Only fools BUY water!

Next time the utility bill comes in the post you'll be reminded quite
otherwise.
There is a slight difference in the per litre price of bottled water
against 'Chateau Robinet'. Rather than put a full bottle in the fridge, BTW,
put a half-full one in the freezer overnight, then top up with tap water...
Brian