(3) When travelling from the north of the Thameslink route (say
Cricklewood) into central London, are tickets issued to 'London
Terminals' or to specific named stations (e.g. Kings Cross Thameslink /
City Thameslink)?

To the specific named station once north of Kings Cross Thameslink.

I think there's a bit of confusion here - for this third query I was
wondering what happens when travelling *from* north London / north of
London to central London - .e.g. for a Cricklewood to KX Thameslink
journey would the ticket issued be to the destination 'London
Terminals'.

Presumably if the journey was Cricklewood to Farringdon or City
Thameslink the ticket would be issued to U1 - I wonder if this would
also be the case if their destination was Blackfriars or Elephant &
Castle?


From stations north of London on the Thameslink route,
tickets are issued to 'London Terminals' for St. Pancras and Kings Cross
Thameslink
and to 'London Thameslink' for Farringdon, Barbican, Moorgate, City
Thameslink, Blackfriars and London Bridge.
'London Thameslink' tickets are for Thameslink (FCC) only and not valid on
the tube.

For destinations in zone 1, tickets are issued to U12 to allow interchange
at West Hampstead.

Note that from Bedford at least, an all day travelcard is cheaper than a
standard return to Zone 1, so will be issued if anyone asks for a return to
a Zone 1 destination.

--
Peter

Paul Oter wrote:

Mizter T wrote:

The NFM does not specify what ticket would be issued for journeys from
the south to Kings Cross Thameslink - I'd be interested to know if it
would be issued to KX Thameslink specifically or just to U1. Does
anyone know for sure?

At Gatwick Airport recently I purchased a single to King's Cross
Thameslink. The ticket stated that KXTL was the destination, and it
bore the words "Route Thameslink".


Thanks - that pretty much clears everything up with regards to this
query. KX Thameslink is a specific destination, the problem seems to be
that some ticket offices don't realise this and will sell passengers a
U1 ticket instead.

I think the 'Route Thameslink' wording might actually relate to your
ticket being an operator-specific ticket - i.e. between London and
Gatwick I believe there are several tickets available - FCC/Thameslink
only, an any permitted route ticket for any trains, a Southern only
ticket, a Gatwick Express only ticket - I'm a bit hazy with regards to
this to be honest.

Anyway as you were obviously going to be travelling on Thameslink to
get to Kings Cross, and there'd be no benefit in you going up to London
Bridge on a Southern train and changing - as all the Thameslink trains
that stop at LB will have previously stopped at Gatwick - you were
quite reasonably sold an FCC/Thameslink-only ticket.

Mizter T wrote:
Paul Oter wrote:

Mizter T wrote:

The NFM does not specify what ticket would be issued for journeys from
the south to Kings Cross Thameslink - I'd be interested to know if it
would be issued to KX Thameslink specifically or just to U1. Does
anyone know for sure?

At Gatwick Airport recently I purchased a single to King's Cross
Thameslink. The ticket stated that KXTL was the destination, and it
bore the words "Route Thameslink".

I think the 'Route Thameslink' wording might actually relate to your
ticket being an operator-specific ticket - i.e. between London and
Gatwick I believe there are several tickets available - FCC/Thameslink
only, an any permitted route ticket for any trains, a Southern only
ticket, a Gatwick Express only ticket - I'm a bit hazy with regards to
this to be honest.

Yes, I assumed it was valid on TL (FCC) trains only, and I couldn't
have used a Southern train for the Gatwick - East Croydon section even
though this is on the Thameslink route. Though the use of the word
"route" does make this a bit ambiguous - is this a reference to the
route or the operator?


Anyway as you were obviously going to be travelling on Thameslink to
get to Kings Cross, and there'd be no benefit in you going up to London
Bridge on a Southern train and changing - as all the Thameslink trains
that stop at LB will have previously stopped at Gatwick - you were
quite reasonably sold an FCC/Thameslink-only ticket.

I bought the ticket from a machine at Gatwick, specifying KXTL as the
destination.

I didn't ask for a U1 ticket partly because I suspected that it might
be more expensive and partly because I was carrying a Annual Gold Card
and know that you don't get a GOLDC discount on the LU element of such
fares.

PaulO

Peter Lawrence wrote:
On 5 Jul 2006 08:23:45 -0700, "Mizter T" wrote:


Ticket offices sometimes sell you a zonal ticket when there is a
cheaper non-Underground version available; worth checking for this,

Equally, they'll sometimes do the opposite!

Like the time I was sold a ticket only valid on "The Other Railway"
from one of the Greenwich stations to Vauxhall.

You can get there without going on the underground, but it's tortuous
and takes about twice as long, so I wound up having to buy a zonal
ticket in addition!

I suppose there is always the possibility the ticket was valid to go on
the underground, but I think it unlikely.

On 6 Jul 2006 07:44:14 -0700, wrote:

Ticket offices sometimes sell you a zonal ticket when there is a
cheaper non-Underground version available; worth checking for this,

Equally, they'll sometimes do the opposite!

Like the time I was sold a ticket only valid on "The Other Railway"
from one of the Greenwich stations to Vauxhall.

(How many Greenwich stations are there?)

You can get there without going on the underground, but it's tortuous
and takes about twice as long, so I wound up having to buy a zonal
ticket in addition!

Did you spot the NR-only route via Waterloo East and Waterloo? It's
probably quicker than any route involving the Underground.

asdf wrote:

On 6 Jul 2006 07:44:14 -0700, wrote:

Ticket offices sometimes sell you a zonal ticket when there is a
cheaper non-Underground version available; worth checking for this,

Equally, they'll sometimes do the opposite!

Like the time I was sold a ticket only valid on "The Other Railway"
from one of the Greenwich stations to Vauxhall.

(How many Greenwich stations are there?)

At a quick count, four: Greenwich station (NR and DLR); Cutty Sark
(DLR); and North Greenwich (Jubilee Line); and Maze Hill (NR) which is
in East Greenwich. Though the only place you'd be sold a NR ticket to
Vauxhall would be Greenwich station proper.

By the by I'm not sure North Greenwich station should really be have
been named as such, it should perhaps have been named Greenwich
Peninsula instead.

Why? There was long gone North Greenwich station (closed 1926) on the
southern tip of the Isle of Dogs over the river from Greenwich - see
the Disused Stations website [1]. This mirrors the north-of-the-river
naming of North Woolwich, across the Thames from Woolwich proper.

However the area name of North Woolwich seems to have stuck - well,
it's used on streetmaps at least, I haven't spoken to anyone local to
the area, whilst I've no idea if anyone ever called the area on the
south of the Isle of Dogs "North Greenwich" apart from the railway. No
one calls the area that now, I'm (almost) certain of that.

Meanwhile the Greenwich Peninsula appears to be the name is use - above
ground at least - for the area around the Dome, and I think this is
what people called it before the coming of the Dome and the Jubilee
line too.

This is really a local history question, but it definitely has a
railway/transport angle.


You can get there without going on the underground, but it's tortuous
and takes about twice as long, so I wound up having to buy a zonal
ticket in addition!

Did you spot the NR-only route via Waterloo East and Waterloo? It's
probably quicker than any route involving the Underground.

Yeah, I'm certain that's quicker than any other route. The routes via
overground *and* the Tube are the more tortuous - I guess you'd go to
London Bridge and take the Jubilee to Green Park, then the Victoria to
Vauxhall, alternatively from London Bridge you'd go southbound on the
Northern to Stockwell and change to the Victoria northbound to
Vauxhall. Definitely a longer route than Greenwich to Waterloo East
(with a possible change at London Bridge), then Waterloo proper to
Vauxhall.

Mizter T wrote:
Why? There was long gone North Greenwich station (closed 1926) on the
southern tip of the Isle of Dogs over the river from Greenwich - see
the Disused Stations website [1]. This mirrors the north-of-the-river
naming of North Woolwich, across the Thames from Woolwich proper.

Argh - I forgot the footnote...

[1]
http://www.subbrit.org.uk/sb-sites/s...ch/index.shtml

I also made a complete hash of modifying the subject line, I'll leave
it be rather than creating more of a mess. Apologies.

"Mizter T" wrote:

I know this is a bit of an old chestnut, but having sifted through a
few previous discussions here on Google Groups I'm still a little
unclear on what the ticketing rules are. I'm hoping the oracles of this
ng might be able to offer clarification.

There are posters at Farringdon that say that "London Terminals"
tickets are not valid there.
--
Roy

Mizter T wrote:

By the by I'm not sure North Greenwich station should really be have
been named as such, it should perhaps have been named Greenwich
Peninsula instead.

Why? There was long gone North Greenwich station (closed 1926) on the
southern tip of the Isle of Dogs over the river from Greenwich - see
the Disused Stations website [1].

So Ryanair style dubious naming was in practice way back then!

This mirrors the north-of-the-river
naming of North Woolwich, across the Thames from Woolwich proper.

Yes but wasn't North Woolwich administratively part of Woolwich? I don't
think it was part of the Hams pre 1965.

"Tim Roll-Pickering" wrote in message
...
Mizter T wrote:

By the by I'm not sure North Greenwich station should really be have
been named as such, it should perhaps have been named Greenwich
Peninsula instead.

Why? There was long gone North Greenwich station (closed 1926) on the
southern tip of the Isle of Dogs over the river from Greenwich - see
the Disused Stations website [1].

So Ryanair style dubious naming was in practice way back then!

This mirrors the north-of-the-river
naming of North Woolwich, across the Thames from Woolwich proper.

Yes but wasn't North Woolwich administratively part of Woolwich? I don't
think it was part of the Hams pre 1965.

It was indeed in Woolwich Borough in LCC days. IIRC North Woolwich was part
of Kent before the LCC was set up, and indeed, part of the Kingdom of Kent
when it was independent of the rest of England in around the 8th Century.

Peter