AstraVanMan wrote:

1. M25, then A40/M40 to Hanger Lane [1], then A406 to Brent Cross, taking
A41 towards London. Third left (excluding the ones on the sliproad just as
you join the A41) into Wayside, 2nd left into Armitage Road, straight across
two sets of lights, and follow the road up to Meadway until Kingsley Way
(about 0.8 miles), then left onto Kingsley Way, straight over the first set
of lights (A1 junction),

Interesting way to avoid Henlys Corner.

and right at the top onto East End Road, which
leads into East Finchley. Then just follow the A504 through East Finchley,
Muswell Hill

technically "following" the A504 through Muswell Hill means by-passing
Queens Avenue.

Hornsey,

I use A1 Lyttleton Road/Aylmer Road then left onto A1000 for a few
yards then through Woodside Avenue, Cranley Gardens, The Chine and left
into Park Road before joining the A504 by turning right into Priory
Road.

leading up to Seven Sisters,

Which means at Turnpike Lane you must turn right then left again,
because the obvious "ahead" is the A1080 Westbury Road which takes you
up to Lordship Lane.

And as you're going to head for Seven Sisters anyway you may as well
use Philip Lane which is the B153.

and up to Walthamstow
from there. From joining East End Road things might be a little slow, but
far less worse than the alternatives IMHO.

I wouldn't be so sure.

2. M25 around to the A10 junction, then A10 towards London, and first left
towards Enfield Lock - then follow the A1055 past Enfield Lock and
Brimsdown, either picking up the North Circular where you come to it, or
just carry on to Tottenham Hale and go into Walthamstow from there.
Either of those should avoid most of the worst traffic blackspots for that
journey.

No, you should leave at J24 and go through the A111.

[1] You could go A30/A312, or M4/A312, but you're probably as well just
staying on the M25 if you're starting on it, and if you go A30/A312 the
queues can be a pain coming up to the M4.

There are rat-runs for that too, but the main road is generally faster.
You'd be surprised how often staying on the main road and moving slowly
with the traffic queue is actually faster than the seemingly flowing
alternative routes.

"Earl Purple" wrote:
1. M25, then A40/M40 to Hanger Lane [1], then A406 to Brent Cross,
taking
A41 towards London. Third left (excluding the ones on the sliproad just
as
you join the A41) into Wayside, 2nd left into Armitage Road, straight
across
two sets of lights, and follow the road up to Meadway until Kingsley Way
(about 0.8 miles), then left onto Kingsley Way, straight over the first
set
of lights (A1 junction),

Interesting way to avoid Henlys Corner.

Works superbly though. I've also worked out a near-perfect route going the
other way too, by a bit of trial and error. It takes advantage of the
stationary traffic heading towards the A406 on Golders Green Road by cutting
across it and using the side roads. Basically, from the North Circular just
west of the A10 junction it goes Melville Gardens, Upsdell Avenue/Berkshire
Gardens (the trick is to pick one not too close to the Clockhouse Junction
as that'll be full of rat-runners heading towards the A406), then cut
through to Palmerstone Road, cut through Finsbury Road, end of Nightingale
Road, right onto Bounds Green Road (quite easy as traffic comes in clear
fits and starts). Then head for Dukes Avenue/Queens Avenue, cut out the
East Finchley crossroads using Parkhall/Baronsmere Roads, then The Bishops
Avenue, right onto A1, Winnington Road/Holne Chase/Meadway/Hoop Lane,
straight over Finchley Road, right onto Elmcroft/Beechcroft Avenue, head
down Ravenscroft Avenue to Golders Green Road, right onto that, then left
almost immediately onto Woodstock Avenue, and cut through to the
lesser-known junction of Western Avenue and the A406, and left onto the
A406. Works an absolute treat. And well done to those that stayed awake.

and right at the top onto East End Road, which
leads into East Finchley. Then just follow the A504 through East
Finchley,
Muswell Hill

technically "following" the A504 through Muswell Hill means by-passing
Queens Avenue.

Hornsey,

I use A1 Lyttleton Road/Aylmer Road then left onto A1000 for a few
yards then through Woodside Avenue, Cranley Gardens, The Chine and left
into Park Road before joining the A504 by turning right into Priory
Road.

Makes sense. Hadn't really considered that way before.

2. M25 around to the A10 junction, then A10 towards London, and first
left
towards Enfield Lock - then follow the A1055 past Enfield Lock and
Brimsdown, either picking up the North Circular where you come to it, or
just carry on to Tottenham Hale and go into Walthamstow from there.
Either of those should avoid most of the worst traffic blackspots for
that
journey.

No, you should leave at J24 and go through the A111.

I'd be interested to see if there's much difference between the two. Coming
off at J25 should be relatively easy because of the junction design
(dedicated lane for J25 - or have they changed it yet, for the greater good
of through traffic flow?), and obviously traffic heading towards London and
all the Brimsdown industrial estates is all coming in the opposite direction
so you'd be against the main flow of traffic. Obviously the A111 has that
going for it as well, but I'd choose the A1055 route myself.

[1] You could go A30/A312, or M4/A312, but you're probably as well just
staying on the M25 if you're starting on it, and if you go A30/A312 the
queues can be a pain coming up to the M4.

There are rat-runs for that too, but the main road is generally faster.
You'd be surprised how often staying on the main road and moving slowly
with the traffic queue is actually faster than the seemingly flowing
alternative routes.

Yup, I'm well aware of that. Thinking about it, though - my main problem in
the past has been the queueing in the left lane heading for the Westbound
M4.

--
"For want of the price of tea and a slice, the old man died."

AstraVanMan wrote:

Works superbly though. I've also worked out a near-perfect route going the
other way too, by a bit of trial and error. It takes advantage of the
stationary traffic heading towards the A406 on Golders Green Road by cutting
across it and using the side roads.

Basically, from the North Circular just
west of the A10 junction it goes Melville Gardens, Upsdell Avenue/Berkshire
Gardens (the trick is to pick one not too close to the Clockhouse Junction
as that'll be full of rat-runners heading towards the A406), then cut
through to Palmerstone Road, cut through Finsbury Road, end of Nightingale
Road,

I used to aim for Upsdell Avenue and Whittington Road but there's too
much traffic rat-running the other way, plus there are too many that
turn right out of Upsdell Avenue that get in the way.

So now I use Sylvan Avenue or Woodside Avenue, then across into Truro
Road, across Palmerston Road and usually round Clarence Road to turn
right into Bounds Green Road.

right onto Bounds Green Road (quite easy as traffic comes in clear
fits and starts). Then head for Dukes Avenue/Queens Avenue, cut out the
East Finchley crossroads using Parkhall/Baronsmere Roads, then The Bishops
Avenue, right onto A1

Nasty turn. But I usually head down Muswell Hill Road and right into
Woodside Avenue, left onto A1000 then through the garage to get to the
A1 Westbound. Usually safe enough to follow that up to Henlys Corner as
the traffic queue from there is much shorter. However if you need to
get out before the merge then turn left into Kingsley Way or Northway.

, Winnington Road/Holne Chase/Meadway/Hoop Lane,

Here turn right into Temple Fortune Road at the roundabout then cross
over to Bridge Lane and join the North Circular Road there. In spite of
streetmap.co.uk there is indeed a junction there.

straight over Finchley Road, right onto Elmcroft/Beechcroft Avenue, head
down Ravenscroft Avenue to Golders Green Road, right onto that, then left
almost immediately onto Woodstock Avenue, and cut through to the
lesser-known junction of Western Avenue and the A406, and left onto the
A406. Works an absolute treat. And well done to those that stayed awake.

Why go onto Golders Green Road at all? Just cross it at Hoop Lane onto
Armitage Road, right into The Ridgeway, round into Wessex Gardens, then
right into Wessex Way and work your way through from there. There are a
couple of routes, the simplest being round Hamilton Road but you can
also get to Elmcroft Crescent, The Drive, Highfield Avenue and Western
Avenue as before.

I'd be interested to see if there's much difference between the two. Coming
off at J25 should be relatively easy because of the junction design
(dedicated lane for J25 - or have they changed it yet, for the greater good
of through traffic flow?), and obviously traffic heading towards London and
all the Brimsdown industrial estates is all coming in the opposite direction
so you'd be against the main flow of traffic. Obviously the A111 has that
going for it as well, but I'd choose the A1055 route myself.

If you really want the A1055 you can turn off the A111 onto the A1005
then back-roads north of Enfield via Gordon Hill hitting the A1055 at
Brimsdown.

"Earl Purple" wrote:
I used to aim for Upsdell Avenue and Whittington Road but there's too
much traffic rat-running the other way, plus there are too many that
turn right out of Upsdell Avenue that get in the way.

Well, it's just a case of finding one that's reliable enough to use
regularly. They're all parallel and end up on the same road, so it's just a
case of take your pick. It's been a while since I've been down that way

So now I use Sylvan Avenue or Woodside Avenue, then across into Truro
Road, across Palmerston Road and usually round Clarence Road to turn
right into Bounds Green Road.

Turning right into BGR from Whittington Road? I always found there to be a
bit of a queue there - I think it was Nightingale Road I used (it's not
shown as an actual junction on my A-Z, but there is one).

right onto Bounds Green Road (quite easy as traffic comes in clear
fits and starts). Then head for Dukes Avenue/Queens Avenue, cut out the
East Finchley crossroads using Parkhall/Baronsmere Roads, then The
Bishops
Avenue, right onto A1

Nasty turn.

Yup - often I'd go straight on, and then quickly (sneakily) u-turn where I
could and go back and turn left onto the A1, rather than wait in a huge
queue to turn right from the other direction.

But I usually head down Muswell Hill Road and right into
Woodside Avenue, left onto A1000 then through the garage to get to the
A1 Westbound. Usually safe enough to follow that up to Henlys Corner as
the traffic queue from there is much shorter. However if you need to
get out before the merge then turn left into Kingsley Way or Northway.

Northway's a pain - tried it once, far too many parked cars etc etc. Mind
you, Kingsley Way can get a bit like that.

, Winnington Road/Holne Chase/Meadway/Hoop Lane,

Here turn right into Temple Fortune Road at the roundabout then cross
over to Bridge Lane and join the North Circular Road there. In spite of
streetmap.co.uk there is indeed a junction there.

Tried that one once - took seemingly forever to get out onto Finchley Road -
nightmare with all the shops/pedestrians etc there. Never again.

straight over Finchley Road, right onto Elmcroft/Beechcroft Avenue, head
down Ravenscroft Avenue to Golders Green Road, right onto that, then left
almost immediately onto Woodstock Avenue, and cut through to the
lesser-known junction of Western Avenue and the A406, and left onto the
A406. Works an absolute treat. And well done to those that stayed
awake.

Why go onto Golders Green Road at all? Just cross it at Hoop Lane onto
Armitage Road, right into The Ridgeway, round into Wessex Gardens, then
right into Wessex Way and work your way through from there. There are a
couple of routes, the simplest being round Hamilton Road but you can
also get to Elmcroft Crescent, The Drive, Highfield Avenue and Western
Avenue as before.

Well, one plan was to do that, but there was quite a queue in Hoop Lane to
cross Golders Green Road, mainly (IIRC) as a result of traffic on GGR
blocking the junction, so I turned off and found another way, and it worked
a treat. Mainly thanks to (a) the fact that it's very easy to turn right
onto a main road where the traffic's very close to stationary a lot of the
time, and (b) the fact that it only involves using a very short stretch of
GGR.

I'd be interested to see if there's much difference between the two.
Coming
off at J25 should be relatively easy because of the junction design
(dedicated lane for J25 - or have they changed it yet, for the greater
good
of through traffic flow?), and obviously traffic heading towards London
and
all the Brimsdown industrial estates is all coming in the opposite
direction
so you'd be against the main flow of traffic. Obviously the A111 has
that
going for it as well, but I'd choose the A1055 route myself.

If you really want the A1055 you can turn off the A111 onto the A1005
then back-roads north of Enfield via Gordon Hill hitting the A1055 at
Brimsdown.

Defeats the object really - the only real reason for mentioning the A1055
was that it's very easily accessible from M25 J25 - something which I
thought would be a good idea as I assumed it'd be fairly easy to get off
there thanks to the dedicated lane - i.e. when everyone else is crowding
into the other 2 lanes the left lane should be fairly clear once the
shuffling about has completed.

--
"For want of the price of tea and a slice, the old man died."

AstraVanMan wrote:

Then head for Dukes Avenue/Queens Avenue,
cut out the East Finchley crossroads using
Parkhall/Baronsmere Roads, then The Bishops Avenue

Exiting Baronsmere Road to High Rd East Finchley is illegal, unless you're
riding a bicycle.

John Rowland wrote:
AstraVanMan wrote:

Then head for Dukes Avenue/Queens Avenue,
cut out the East Finchley crossroads using
Parkhall/Baronsmere Roads, then The Bishops Avenue

Exiting Baronsmere Road to High Rd East Finchley is illegal, unless you're
riding a bicycle.

Indeed you have to use Fairlawn Avenue which is a through road in that
direction. Easier though is to just go ahead at the light, then turn
left into Deansway and cut through Brim Hill (bumpy but empty).

Andrew Wyatt wrote:
Opinions requested - in two weeks time on a Thursday my family will be
coming to visit us, and will be driving from Heathrow Airport to
Walthamstow, starting out from Heathrow at about 15:30.

I guess the two obvious routes are M25-M11 or A4-A406-A10. What do you think
would be quickest at that time of day? Typically, how busy are the two roads
main roads (M25/A406) then?

A10 would be the wrong exit from the A406. For Walthamstow you will
want to exit on A112 (Chingford Road) at Crooked Billet or possibly
A104 then right onto A503.

Also you'd want to take the route A312/A40/A406 rather than A4/A406.

The parts of the A406 you may find slow are around Henlys Corner (A1
junction) (not usually so bad in that direction, worse the other way)
and Bounds Green to Palmers Green. There are some road-works at the
moment just before Henlys Corner but they are night-time only and
shouldn't affect you.

The M25 route is a long way round. Might be worthwhile though. As an
alternative to leaving at M11 you can leave at J24 and take the A111
until it meets the North Circular at the Great Cambridge Roundabout.
That road is generally fairly clear except for a small hold-up in the
middle of Southgate.

Then there is the "central" route:

A40 all the way to Marylebone (where it becomes A501)

left onto A4201 (Albany Street) (just after Regents Park, which you can
go through as an alternative). Follow the road round into Parkway and
at Britannia Junction (Camden Town) take A503 Camden Road and follow
this road all the way to Walthamstow.

"Earl Purple" wrote in message
oups.com...


Then there is the "central" route:

A40 all the way to Marylebone (where it becomes A501)

left onto A4201 (Albany Street) (just after Regents Park, which you can
go through as an alternative). Follow the road round into Parkway and
at Britannia Junction (Camden Town) take A503 Camden Road and follow
this road all the way to Walthamstow.


yes, don't rule out this option - at that time of day, this will be a crawl
lasting hours but may be a bit more predictable than the circular routes
(i.e. there's less risk of getting completely stuck).

The tube is more predictable, less stressful and will take half the time
compared to driving, whatever route you choose, but I guess there's a
special reason why you need to drive.

j

Jim wrote:
"Earl Purple" wrote in message
oups.com...


Then there is the "central" route:

A40 all the way to Marylebone (where it becomes A501)

left onto A4201 (Albany Street) (just after Regents Park, which you can
go through as an alternative). Follow the road round into Parkway and
at Britannia Junction (Camden Town) take A503 Camden Road and follow
this road all the way to Walthamstow.


yes, don't rule out this option - at that time of day, this will be a crawl
lasting hours but may be a bit more predictable than the circular routes
(i.e. there's less risk of getting completely stuck).

The tube is more predictable, less stressful and will take half the time
compared to driving, whatever route you choose, but I guess there's a
special reason why you need to drive.

j

you can also cut out a bit more of Marylebone Road by turning left into
Lisson Grove (2nd traffic light after the flyover) or even into the
first one (is it Bell Street?) and then rigth to get onto Lisson Grove.
Then right at the 2nd traffic light (St John's Wood Road), past the A41
and along Prince Albert Road then left into Parkway and as before.

"Earl Purple" wrote:
left onto A4201 (Albany Street) (just after Regents Park, which you can
go through as an alternative). Follow the road round into Parkway and
at Britannia Junction (Camden Town) take A503 Camden Road and follow
this road all the way to Walthamstow.

yes, don't rule out this option - at that time of day, this will be a
crawl
lasting hours but may be a bit more predictable than the circular routes
(i.e. there's less risk of getting completely stuck).

The tube is more predictable, less stressful and will take half the time
compared to driving, whatever route you choose, but I guess there's a
special reason why you need to drive.

you can also cut out a bit more of Marylebone Road by turning left into
Lisson Grove (2nd traffic light after the flyover) or even into the
first one (is it Bell Street?) and then rigth to get onto Lisson Grove.
Then right at the 2nd traffic light (St John's Wood Road), past the A41
and along Prince Albert Road then left into Parkway and as before.

But if they're leaving Heathrow at 3:30pm, they'll be getting to Marylebone
around 4-4:30-ish, and the inbound flow on the A40 is actually very good -
the issues won't start until coming away from Camden on the A503.

--
"For want of the price of tea and a slice, the old man died."