In message lgate.org
"Nick Lawford" wrote:

[snip]

There was so much negative thinking in your response. If everything
proposed was dealt with your way nothing would ever move forward. It was
that type of thinking that leads to the ''we don't want air brakes
because we've already got vacuum brakes'', ''we've already got paraffin
tail lamps what do we need electric lamps for'' and ''BedPan and
Blackfriars work perfectly well what do we need Thameslink for''
brigade. We'd still be running unbraked open trucks with men waving red
flags in front of them.


Which reminds me, what happened to Henry Law?

--
Graeme Wall
This address is not read, substitute trains for rail.
Transport Miscellany at http://www.greywall.demon.co.uk/rail/index.html

On Feb 15, 1:53 pm, "Nick Lawford" wrote:

are they ? Met A stock knocks NR infrasture to pieces every time one
goes to Amersham ?

I think you can work out what I mean ... neither 165/168s nor A60/A62
damages the infrastrucure of the opposite operator.

--
Nick

On Thu, 15 Feb 2007 21:53:21 +0000 (UTC), "Nick Lawford"
wrote:

"Boltar" wrote in message

What for?

I'll throw that one back at you and ask ''why not''. The Bakerloo goes
to Harrow (and used to go to Watford), the ELLX is projecting LU service
over NR routes, Croxley link (if ever) are examples.

Its being designed for the tube system

Actually, no its not.

S-stock does NOT run in the tubes but on the sub-surface lines.

not national rail.
Different radio
systems, different ATP systems

So what ?

Stop looking at details and think about the bigger picture.

, possibly a slightly different loading
gauge,. not to mention
the 4th rail shoes dangling inbetween the rails that could foul some
mainline track systems.

So 4th rail surface trains are out of gauge at Wimbledon and Richmond
are they ?

They are out of gauge WRT to normal NR clearances. This does not
matter when they are running normally over lines where required
clearances are maintained.

Met A stock knocks NR infrasture to pieces every time one
goes to Amersham ?

It doesn't run over NR infrastructure; the line has always belonged
solely or jointly to LU and its predecessors.

S-stock is being built as common stock for all sub-surface lines. I'd be
pretty sure that spec would more or less put them within NR gauge.

It won't. The out-of-gauge-ness of LU surface stock is principally
around floor level and just below IIRC; this is mitigated to some
extent by the general shortness of the vehicles compared with main
line stock so that in general precautions are only necessary while
passing through platforms on curves or over crossovers within
platforms. AFAIAA it is standard practice to remove the shoegear when
LU trains are dragged over NR lines other than those over which they
are cleared to operate.

snip

On Thu, 15 Feb 2007, Nick Lawford wrote:

"Boltar" wrote in message

What for?

There was so much negative thinking in your response. If everything
proposed was dealt with your way nothing would ever move forward. It was
that type of thinking that leads to the ''we don't want air brakes
because we've already got vacuum brakes'', ''we've already got paraffin
tail lamps what do we need electric lamps for'' and ''BedPan and
Blackfriars work perfectly well what do we need Thameslink for''
brigade. We'd still be running unbraked open trucks with men waving red
flags in front of them.

Nonsense! Dangerous modern rubbish! Stagecoaches, sir! Quite satisfactory!

tom

--
Programming is a skill best acquired by practice and example rather than
from books -- Alan Turing

On Thu, 15 Feb 2007, BH Williams wrote:

"Tom Anderson" wrote in message
.li...
On Thu, 15 Feb 2007, Christopher A.Lee wrote:

On Thu, 15 Feb 2007 16:28:50 -0000, "Peter Masson"
wrote:

"Boltar" wrote

Anyway , why would district stock ever run through to tilbury anyway?

1910 - 1939 there were through trains between Ealing Broadway and
Southend, electric-hauled over the District between Ealing Broadway and
Barking, and changing engines there.

Short clerestory roofed electric engines

Long clerestory-windowed Christian churches, i've heard of; how does a
clerestory roof work?

A raised centre section to the roof, in the side of which may be either
glass windows or sometimes ventilator louvres. They were a common
feature of 19th century carriage design.- perhaps as a means of
'borrowing' light for the middle of compartments.

Having thought about this - (a) was this before they'd thought of
skylights and (b) what was the point of putting such a thing on the
engine, rather than the passenger carriages?

tom

--
Programming is a skill best acquired by practice and example rather than
from books -- Alan Turing

Tom Anderson wrote:
Nonsense! Dangerous modern rubbish! Stagecoaches, sir! Quite satisfactory!

I agree. No less an authority than Dr Dionysius Lardner has warned us of
the dangers of high speed travel.
--
Bruce Fletcher
Stronsay, Orkney
www.stronsay.co.uk/claremont
"It's not that I think stupidity should be punishable by death. I just
think we should take the warning labels off of everything and let the
problem take care of itself."

"Graeme Wall" wrote in message
...
In message lgate.org
"Nick Lawford" wrote:

[snip]

There was so much negative thinking in your response. If everything
proposed was dealt with your way nothing would ever move forward. It was
that type of thinking that leads to the ''we don't want air brakes
because we've already got vacuum brakes'', ''we've already got paraffin
tail lamps what do we need electric lamps for'' and ''BedPan and
Blackfriars work perfectly well what do we need Thameslink for''
brigade. We'd still be running unbraked open trucks with men waving red
flags in front of them.


Which reminds me, what happened to Henry Law?

--
Graeme Wall
This address is not read, substitute trains for rail.
Transport Miscellany at http://www.greywall.demon.co.uk/rail/index.html
He writes VERY long letters to Rail Professional....
Brian

"Tom Anderson" wrote in message
h.li...
On Thu, 15 Feb 2007, BH Williams wrote:

"Tom Anderson" wrote in message
.li...
On Thu, 15 Feb 2007, Christopher A.Lee wrote:

On Thu, 15 Feb 2007 16:28:50 -0000, "Peter Masson"
wrote:

"Boltar" wrote

Anyway , why would district stock ever run through to tilbury anyway?

1910 - 1939 there were through trains between Ealing Broadway and
Southend, electric-hauled over the District between Ealing Broadway
and
Barking, and changing engines there.

Short clerestory roofed electric engines

Long clerestory-windowed Christian churches, i've heard of; how does a
clerestory roof work?

A raised centre section to the roof, in the side of which may be either
glass windows or sometimes ventilator louvres. They were a common feature
of 19th century carriage design.- perhaps as a means of 'borrowing' light
for the middle of compartments.

Having thought about this - (a) was this before they'd thought of
skylights and (b) what was the point of putting such a thing on the
engine, rather than the passenger carriages?

tom

--
Programming is a skill best acquired by practice and example rather than
from books -- Alan Turing
Skylights are quite difficult to make water-proof (our old Citroen BX with
indoor swimming pool was proof of that..).
As to why such things were fitted to an electric loco? They may have been
there to illuminate the internal workings or, perhaps more likely, as
ventilation.
Brian

In message
Tom Anderson wrote:

On Thu, 15 Feb 2007, BH Williams wrote:

"Tom Anderson" wrote in message
.li...
On Thu, 15 Feb 2007, Christopher A.Lee wrote:

On Thu, 15 Feb 2007 16:28:50 -0000, "Peter Masson"
wrote:

"Boltar" wrote

Anyway , why would district stock ever run through to tilbury anyway?

1910 - 1939 there were through trains between Ealing Broadway and
Southend, electric-hauled over the District between Ealing Broadway and
Barking, and changing engines there.

Short clerestory roofed electric engines

Long clerestory-windowed Christian churches, i've heard of; how does a
clerestory roof work?

A raised centre section to the roof, in the side of which may be either
glass windows or sometimes ventilator louvres. They were a common
feature of 19th century carriage design.- perhaps as a means of
'borrowing' light for the middle of compartments.

Having thought about this - (a) was this before they'd thought of
skylights and (b) what was the point of putting such a thing on the
engine, rather than the passenger carriages?


I suspect two reasons, one it provided ventilation for the electrics, and two
it matched the profile of the rolling stock.

--
Graeme Wall
This address is not read, substitute trains for rail.
Transport Miscellany at http://www.greywall.demon.co.uk/rail/index.html

In message
"BH Williams" wrote:


"Graeme Wall" wrote in message
...
In message lgate.org
"Nick Lawford" wrote:

[snip]

There was so much negative thinking in your response. If everything
proposed was dealt with your way nothing would ever move forward. It was
that type of thinking that leads to the ''we don't want air brakes
because we've already got vacuum brakes'', ''we've already got paraffin
tail lamps what do we need electric lamps for'' and ''BedPan and
Blackfriars work perfectly well what do we need Thameslink for''
brigade. We'd still be running unbraked open trucks with men waving red
flags in front of them.


Which reminds me, what happened to Henry Law?

--
Graeme Wall
This address is not read, substitute trains for rail.
Transport Miscellany at http://www.greywall.demon.co.uk/rail/index.html
He writes VERY long letters to Rail Professional....

Must keep the editor happy.

--
Graeme Wall
This address is not read, substitute trains for rail.
Transport Miscellany at http://www.greywall.demon.co.uk/rail/index.html