Southall is not a ZONAL Destination unless travel is using a
Travelcard. A Point to Point Ticket should have been issued. Appeal
against the Penalty Fare on the basis of the wrong ticket being
issued.

RT

On 25 Feb 2007 07:57:50 -0800, "Hertsman" wrote:

Southall is not a ZONAL Destination unless travel is using a
Travelcard. A Point to Point Ticket should have been issued. Appeal
against the Penalty Fare on the basis of the wrong ticket being
issued.

And make one heck of a fuss.

RT

"Christopher A.Lee" wrote in message
...
On 25 Feb 2007 07:57:50 -0800, "Hertsman" wrote:

Southall is not a ZONAL Destination unless travel is using a
Travelcard. A Point to Point Ticket should have been issued. Appeal
against the Penalty Fare on the basis of the wrong ticket being
issued.

Or re-read the OP properly - he wasn't given a PF, he was 'allowed' to buy a
Paddington - Southall ticket.

Paul

There are two different types of zonal fares that apply now. First up, you
have the "rail only" zonal fares, and then there are the "Train-Tube"
fares.

The latter are the only variety valid on the tube and are issued from the
origin station to the appropriate zonal combination (or vice versa).

So, in this example, your friend was issued precisely the correct ticket
(namely Goodmayes to U1234), and the member of staff at Southall was
talking through his backside.

My reading of the NFM section quoted was that the ticket price was based on
the zonal fares but that it should still be issued as a point to point
ticket.

I often used to buy a single from East Croydon to Edmonton Green. The
ticket office staff at East Croydon invariably looked up Edmonton Green in a
big book and then issued me with an East Croydon to U1234 ticket. It used
to annoy me because it cost more than the correct single ticket. I never
realised I was also travelling on an invalid ticket.


G.

On 26 Feb, 20:28, "Graham J" wrote:

I often used to buy a single from East Croydon to Edmonton Green. *The
ticket office staff at East Croydon invariably looked up Edmonton Green in a
big book and then issued me with an East Croydon to U1234 ticket. *It used
to annoy me because it cost more than the correct single ticket. *I never
realised I was also travelling on an invalid ticket.

G.

IMX both as a booking clerk, sorry Customer Service Officer, and as a
passenger, is that the procedure, especially at stations outside or on
the other side of London, goes like this:

Pax: Single to (eg) Streatham Hill please.
Clerk: (1) Looks up Travelcard/london Fare Area map and sees SRH is in
Zone 3, OR (to colleague), "What zone's Streatham Hill in, Dave?")
(2) Issues SDS to U123.

Many staff simply don't understand the difference, as the original
Goodmayes example, and now East Croydon, show. Adequate training is
the only answer. My advice to colleagues was always if you were
unsure, try to issue as a point-to point. If this doesn't work, then
it's more than likely on the Underground, so then check the Travelcard
map and issue a U-zone ticket.

There is always the possibility that it is a non-existent place,
though - I was recently asked for a single to "Bell Common Green".
Turned out it was Bush Hill Park (Enfield) he wanted.

Ken

"Ken" wrote

There is always the possibility that it is a non-existent place,
though - I was recently asked for a single to "Bell Common Green".
Turned out it was Bush Hill Park (Enfield) he wanted.

There is also the possibility that the passenger gives the name of a
station, but actually wants to go somewhere entirely different. The Southern
Region's prime example was Grove Park. The passenger may want the junction
for the Bromley North branch, but he might possibly really want Chiswick (as
Chiswick station is in the area known as Grove Park).

Peter

On Tue, 27 Feb 2007 19:17:54 -0000, "Peter Masson"
wrote:


"Ken" wrote

There is always the possibility that it is a non-existent place,
though - I was recently asked for a single to "Bell Common Green".
Turned out it was Bush Hill Park (Enfield) he wanted.

There is also the possibility that the passenger gives the name of a
station, but actually wants to go somewhere entirely different. The Southern
Region's prime example was Grove Park. The passenger may want the junction
for the Bromley North branch, but he might possibly really want Chiswick (as
Chiswick station is in the area known as Grove Park).

And there are the AMerican tourists used to dropping "Street", "Road"
etc.

When they ask for "Baker" it's obvious, but "Oxford"? Even "Edgware"?


Peter

Terry Casey wrote:
A friend went to Goodmayes station on Friday morning and asked for a single
to Southall, for which he was charged £5.10. He set off via Liverpool Street
and Paddington but when he got to Southall he was told his ticket was
invalid and he would have to pay again - £3.10.

He explained that he had asked for a ticket to Southall and pointed out that
the ticket included zone 4 (both Goodmayes and Southall being in zone 4.)

Wouldn't this be a case for a zero fare excess since the train-tube fare
is the same whether the destination is Zone U1234 or Southall?
--
Michael Hoffman

On 25 Feb, 21:31, Michael Hoffman wrote:
Terry Casey wrote:
A friend went to Goodmayes station on Friday morning and asked for a single
to Southall, for which he was charged £5.10. He set off via Liverpool Street
and Paddington but when he got to Southall he was told his ticket was
invalid and he would have to pay again - £3.10.

He explained that he had asked for a ticket to Southall and pointed out that
the ticket included zone 4 (both Goodmayes and Southall being in zone 4..)

Wouldn't this be a case for a zero fare excess since the train-tube fare
is the same whether the destination is Zone U1234 or Southall?
--
Michael Hoffman


Should have taken the £20 PF and then told the inspector that the
Penalty Fare guidelines as issued by the SRA (as was), state not to PF
passengers from other TOCS or off route.

On Feb 25, 9:31 pm, Michael Hoffman wrote:
Terry Casey wrote:
A friend went to Goodmayes station on Friday morning and asked for a single
to Southall, for which he was charged £5.10. He set off via Liverpool Street
and Paddington but when he got to Southall he was told his ticket was
invalid and he would have to pay again - £3.10.

He explained that he had asked for a ticket to Southall and pointed out that
the ticket included zone 4 (both Goodmayes and Southall being in zone 4..)

Wouldn't this be a case for a zero fare excess since the train-tube fare
is the same whether the destination is Zone U1234 or Southall?



Someone did point out that the revenue would be divided differently,
and FGW wouldn't get any of it, which was why they would have
objected.

Looked at that way, it's not much different, logically, from paying in
advance for a Ryanair flight and trying to use your booking on a train
to Southall because it's the same price. Or handing over your money
in one shop and taking goods out of another on the grounds that the
price was the same.

It's not just a product of the privatised railway, because London
Underground was separate before then.

BUT I don't think it would be a good idea to pay either a penalty fare
or the extra £3.10. The company losing out and the company making the
mistake should fight it out amongst themselves.

I think there would be zero chance of being prosecuted, and almost
zero chance of seeing the money again if one handed it over and tried
to claim back later.