Is there a website which includes details of "odd" stretches of the LU
network not normally used for passenger carrying journeys? I'm
thinking mainly about connecting links between different "lines". Are
any of these quite lengthy? Would most drivers working Line "X" and
Line "Y" be trained to work over a connecting line between the two? Is
the link from the District Line to the East London Line just a short
tunnel section with double-track?

--
gordon

There are no quite lengthly connections, apart from in depots such as
Ruislip which has connections to the Central and Met. The longest one
outside of depots is probably Saint Mary's curve between Aldgate East
and Whitechapel connecting the East London Line to the District, used
for transferring A stock, which as you say is a short double track
tunnel section.

In general, only engineering train operators have a working knowledge
of more than one line.

In message . com,
" writes

Is there a website which includes details of "odd" stretches of the LU
network not normally used for passenger carrying journeys? I'm
thinking mainly about connecting links between different "lines". Are
any of these quite lengthy? Would most drivers working Line "X" and
Line "Y" be trained to work over a connecting line between the two? Is
the link from the District Line to the East London Line just a short
tunnel section with double-track?

I don't know of any specific websites offhand but Tubeprune is likely to
have something. I have a copy of the 2002 London Transport Quail map
which shows all the track plans for LU, hence these links. I obtained
it from the London(s) Transport Museum some time ago, I don't know if
they still sell them though.

There are only a few specific links on LU as most lines have some common
sections (ie. Hammersmith Hanger Lane Junction for the
District/Piccadilly) and transfers can be done easily over these. The
only ones I can think of a

East London District over St. Mary's Curve.
Victoria Piccadilly over the crossover just south of Finsbury Park.
Northern Piccadilly via the Kings Cross Loop (a short tunnel from
Kings Cross (Northern Northbound) to Kings Cross (Piccadilly Eastbound).
CentralMetropolitan/Piccadilly at Ruislip depot. (You can also get
from the CentralDistrict at Ealing Broadway, but this has been disused
for many years, I tink since Central line ATO, and I'm not sure if it's
deemed available any more)
BakerlooJubilee at Baker Street, although as the Bakerloo and Jubilee
used to be the same line once upon a time I'm not sure this counts as a
special link.

With these, it is possible to get from any part of the Underground to
any other part, albeit by some very convoluted routes in some cases.

All 'normal' Underground drivers are allocated to one depot and only
work the line that depot services. Any driver transferring from line X
to line Y would be deemed to have lost their knowledge of line X after 6
months, although within that time they could technically drive both
lines if their line X licence hasn't been withdrawn on transfer. The
only exception to this I can think of is the East London line where the
drivers also 'know' the road to Neasden for stock transfers there for
maintenance. This will stop from the end of the year anyway.

There are a number of Engineering train drivers who drive those little
yellow slug loco things on engineering trains who are required to have
knowledge of the whole combine. There are also a small number of test
train drivers who know everything as they are trained on al stocks on
all lines. They don't get out much as they spend all their lives on
refresher courses!

St. Mary's Curve is indeed double track but due to the sharp curves, the
signalling has been modified to only allow one train in the section at
any one time due to the possibility of trains touching each other.
--
Steve Fitzgerald has now left the building.
You will find him in London's Docklands, E16, UK
(please use the reply to address for email)

"Gordon" writes:
Is there a website which includes details of "odd" stretches of the LU
network not normally used for passenger carrying journeys? I'm
thinking mainly about connecting links between different "lines". Are
any of these quite lengthy? ...

CULG http://www.davros.org/rail/culg/ covers these in the Connections
section for each line, with further description as appropriate in the
Layout or History sections (for example, if the link was at one time
used by trains in service, with the District - East London connection).
--
Mark Brader, Toronto | "I'm not going to post a revision: even USENET
| readers can divide by 100." -- Brian Reid

On 29 Apr, 18:31, (Mark Brader) wrote:
CULG http://www.davros.org/rail/culg/ covers these in the Connections
section for each line, with further description as appropriate in the
Layout or History sections (for example, if the link was at one time
used by trains in service, with the District - East London connection).

Thanks for that and also to the others who have replied.
--
gordon

Steve Fitzgerald wrote:

With these, it is possible to get from any part of the Underground to
any other part, albeit by some very convoluted routes in some cases.

..... apart from the Waterloo & City Line, which trains can only reach by
being lowered by a crane.

On 29 Apr, 16:25, Steve Fitzgerald ] wrote:
St. Mary's Curve is indeed double track but due to the sharp curves, the
signalling has been modified to only allow one train in the section at
any one time due to the possibility of trains touching each other.

That begs the question of why did they build the tunnel that bit too
narrow?

B2003

On Mon, 30 Apr 2007, John Rowland wrote:

Steve Fitzgerald wrote:

With these, it is possible to get from any part of the Underground to
any other part, albeit by some very convoluted routes in some cases.

.... apart from the Waterloo & City Line, which trains can only reach by
being lowered by a crane.

Has consideration ever been given to connecting the W&C to anything? I
reckon you could plumb it into the Central line at Bank; don't know if you
could get it up to mainline level at Waterloo, or anywhere near any of the
tube lines.

tom

--
People don't want nice. People want London. -- Al

Boltar wrote:
On 29 Apr, 16:25, Steve Fitzgerald ] wrote:
St. Mary's Curve is indeed double track but due to the sharp curves,
the signalling has been modified to only allow one train in the
section at any one time due to the possibility of trains touching
each other.

That begs the question of why did they build the tunnel that bit too
narrow?

Or the stock that bit too big?

Seriously, though, 'A' stock was not around when the curve was built. The
length of modern cars and the distance between the bogies means that the
centre of the vehicles swing further out when curving than earlier short
wheelbase stock would have done, with the resulting danger of scraping
trains passing in the other direction. 'A' stock was never intended for the
ELL and only really ended up there as a result of their being some
flexibility in the fleet during a recessional period.

On 30 Apr, 12:52, Tom Anderson wrote:
Has consideration ever been given to connecting the W&C to anything? I
reckon you could plumb it into the Central line at Bank; don't know if you
could get it up to mainline level at Waterloo, or anywhere near any of the
tube lines.

There have been proposals at various times for extensions north, to
meet the ex-Northern City Branch at Moorgate. However, these proposals
always mention that the Bank of England vaults get in the way. I think
in reality, the direction of the W&C platforms at Bank isn't
particularly suited to an extension at Moorgate.

Sam