Just seen this story online:
http://makeashorterlink.com/?N5BE22DA5

When did this project surface and why haven't we heard anything about it
before?

A tram good idea?


STATE-OF-THE-ART trams taking commuters straight to work in the City could
soon be slicing through our streets.
Transport gurus pored over dozens of plans, all bidding to cut the strain on
the train and relieve bursting buses.

And the experts from the Corporation of London believe the tram is the
answer for South Londoners.

They threw their full support behind a second scheme from Battersea to
Hackney in a new idea revealed this week.

Stations could be built in Vauxhall, Elephant and Castle, along Borough High
Street, at London Bridge and then on to Bishopsgate and Shored-itch.

So at one stroke South Londoners who work in the City would have a direct
journey up to the Square Mile.

Massive interchanges would be created at Vauxhall and the Elephant - both in
line for radical overhaul - where passengers swap between trams, Tubes,
trains and buses.

These newest City-bound routes add to existing Cross River Transit plans to
link Brixton and Peckham with north London via Waterloo.

There, branches start at Brixton Popes Road and Peckham Bus Station, meet at
St George's Circus and cross the Thames at Waterloo.

Graham Forbes chairs the Corporation of London's planning and transport
committee.

He said: "There is a desperate need for improved public transport in the
City and we believe this new tram link will help.

"It would also make a major contribution to relieving overcrowding on key
sections of the Underground and improve access to many proposed development
schemes, like at Battersea Power Station, Vauxhall and Elephant and Castle."

But his report shows investment for trams is not "unfathomable" because
there is no need to sink trenches into streets for rails.

The document stands as stage two - the feasibility study - in the bid.

Now stage three starts where bosses pull together full details before
pitching for cash.

--


--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7

"tim" wrote in message
...

"Dave Arquati" wrote in message
...
Just seen this story online:
http://makeashorterlink.com/?N5BE22DA5

When did this project surface and why haven't we heard anything about it
before?

Because you haven't been reading in the right place.

These ideas for 'south to central london' trams have been around for a few
(6 or more) months, though this particular route to the city looks new. I
guess that something Ken has done is encouraging them.

Well Cross River Transit from Peckham and Brixton to Camden and King's Cross
I knew about since it's been around for ages and is well advanced. South
*west* London to the centre is all new to me.

A tram good idea?

IMHO it's a stupid idea. If the routes are overground then they will
get stuck in the traffic just like the buses and if they are underground
the'll be prohibitively expensive. If a dedicated route is the solution
then why not just build one for buses, it will be cheaper and much
more flexible

Tim

See the Croydon tram. Dedicate the route to *trams* not buses and you have a
high capacity, less polluting, more attractive route.

--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7

"tim" wrote in message ...

IMHO it's a stupid idea. If the routes are overground then they will
get stuck in the traffic just like the buses and if they are underground
the'll be prohibitively expensive. If a dedicated route is the solution
then why not just build one for buses, it will be cheaper and much
more flexible

Because buses are (rightly or wrongly) seen as a low-quality transport
method of last resort for poor people. IMHO people generally don't
like travelling by bus because they are cramped, dirty, unreliable and
full of wierdos. You can argue that none of these qualities are
inherent to the bus and that with good planning etc etc... and you
would probably be right, but the travelling public's perception does
matter.

What I'm trying to say is that you could build all the bus routes (as
I said - cramped, dirty, unreliable and full of wierdos) you want but
compared to a tram (new, shiny, aspirational) you'll have a devil of a
time persuading people to use them.

--
sandy

Dave Arquati wrote:
Just seen this story online:
http://makeashorterlink.com/?N5BE22DA5

When did this project surface and why haven't we heard anything about it
before?

A tram good idea?


STATE-OF-THE-ART trams taking commuters straight to work in the City could
soon be slicing through our streets.
Transport gurus pored over dozens of plans, all bidding to cut the strain on
the train and relieve bursting buses.

And the experts from the Corporation of London believe the tram is the
answer for South Londoners.

They threw their full support behind a second scheme from Battersea to
Hackney in a new idea revealed this week.


Hmm - isn't Crossrail line 2 meant to be linking up Battersea to
Hackney? Is this their way of saying that at most we're only going to
get Crossrail line 1 and line 2 is nothing but a pipe-dream...

In message , Stevie
writes

Hmm - isn't Crossrail line 2 meant to be linking up Battersea to
Hackney?

Possibly, but the outer parts of the line are still very much open to
debate.

Is this their way of saying that at most we're only going to get
Crossrail line 1 and line 2 is nothing but a pipe-dream...

I don't really see the tram proposal as any sort of alternative to
Crossrail 2. The latter would be a fast, limited stop service through
the west end - Clapham Junction to King's Cross in three stops.

The tram proposal goes through the city, nowhere near the west end or
King's Cross and would be a very much slower service with a dozen or
more stops catering primarily for local traffic.

--
Paul Terry

"Dave Arquati" wrote in message ...

"tim" wrote in message
...

"Dave Arquati" wrote in message
...
Just seen this story online:
http://makeashorterlink.com/?N5BE22DA5

When did this project surface and why haven't we heard anything about it
before?

Because you haven't been reading in the right place.

These ideas for 'south to central london' trams have been around for a few
(6 or more) months, though this particular route to the city looks new. I
guess that something Ken has done is encouraging them.

Well Cross River Transit from Peckham and Brixton to Camden and King's Cross
I knew about since it's been around for ages and is well advanced. South
*west* London to the centre is all new to me.

A tram good idea?

IMHO it's a stupid idea. If the routes are overground then they will
get stuck in the traffic just like the buses and if they are underground
the'll be prohibitively expensive. If a dedicated route is the solution
then why not just build one for buses, it will be cheaper and much
more flexible

Tim

See the Croydon tram. Dedicate the route to *trams* not buses and you have a
high capacity, less polluting, more attractive route.

90% of this is on segregated, previously under-utilised, railway alignments.
I don't see how it can be comparable?

tim



--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7

"tim" wrote in message
...

"Dave Arquati" wrote in message
...


---8----SNIP-------

90% of this is on segregated, previously under-utilised, railway
alignments.
I don't see how it can be comparable?

---8----SNIP-------

True, a lot of disused railway lines are utilised for Tramlink.

However my wife has used Tramlink as an alternative to the bus since it
opened and it has made a real difference in cutting her journey time.

The fact that Trams have priority over buses and cars is definately a plus
as far as I am concerned and can actually provide an incentive for car
drivers to tram it instead.

Personally I would like to shoot the berk whose idea it was to scrap the
trams in the first place - but then seeing as my dear old Dad took the week
off to do the London Last Tram Week, perhaps I am a bit biassed! :-)