On Sat, 12 Jan 2008 17:50:57 -0000, "Lew 1"
wrote:

My experience on the NLL was that passengers very rarely filled up all the
seats anyway and most were quite content to stand, generally speaking
passengesr don't spend too long on the train. My objection was that the
313's obviously were not designed with metro services in mind and thus
didn't have as many grab rails and general design tit-bits as they really
needed.

Was never a problem on Merseyrail, but then at least they have enough
units and long enough platforms to double up in the peaks. (This is
what TfL should be looking at doing, IMO).

Compare and contrast to longer distance TOC's such as FCC, where every seat
will always get filled up.

Not on Silverlink County. People take every seat on the 2+2 seated
Desiros, but you tend to get 4 to a bay of 6 and 3 to a bay of 4 on
the 2+3 321s, with people generally preferring to stand rather than
take the middle seat.

This is why I think it's stupid (and makes a mockery of the PIXC
figures) for GoVia's new Desiro order (replacing the 321s) to be 2+3
seated, as I understand they will be.

Neil

--
Neil Williams
Put my first name before the at to reply.

On Jan 12, 6:02*pm, (Neil Williams)
wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jan 2008 17:57:33 -0000, "Lew 1"

wrote:
Only once or twice, not enough to really form an opinion. I hadn't thought
that the difference between County and Metro would have been so huge, though
it certainly looks like it was County that was getting the praise. (What was
the Abbey Flyer, County or Metro?)

County, as were the erstwhile London-Brum locals and the
London-Northampton commuter services that I use daily.

I find it strangely amusing that one set of passengers would have related
the brand "Silverlink" with the height of railway filth, whilst another set
saw Silverlink as the railway's Knight in Shining Armour. What difference
one word makes!

It is interesting - I personally have very positive views of the old
Silverlink County, but I agree the old Metro services were disgusting.


How does the shared use of rolling stock work out? I assume that
Watford - St Albans shares stock with the NLL and Bedford - Bletchley
shares stock with the GOBLIN, or is that no longer the case?

On Sat, 12 Jan 2008 17:57:33 -0000, "Lew 1"
wrote:

Did you ever use the County mainline services? They were very
professionally-run, though the last few weeks were marred by the
strikes.

Only once or twice, not enough to really form an opinion. I hadn't thought
that the difference between County and Metro would have been so huge, though
it certainly looks like it was County that was getting the praise. (What was
the Abbey Flyer, County or Metro?)

I find it strangely amusing that one set of passengers would have related
the brand "Silverlink" with the height of railway filth, whilst another set
saw Silverlink as the railway's Knight in Shining Armour. What difference
one word makes!

Silverlink County did have a rocky patch a number of years ago but like
a number of Nat Ex TOCs they just knuckled down and concentrated on the
basics. IIRC they had the most reliable EMUs in Britain with their fleet
of Class 321s based at Bletchley. For a railway getting the most boring
basics right day in, day out is absolutely essential and they did seem
to manage that despite the WCML upgrade works.
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

On 12 Jan, 18:54, Paul Corfield wrote:
Silverlink County did have a rocky patch a number of years ago but like
a number of Nat Ex TOCs they just knuckled down and concentrated on the
basics. IIRC they had the most reliable EMUs in Britain with their fleet
of Class 321s based at Bletchley. *For a railway getting the most boring
basics right day in, day out is absolutely essential and they did seem
to manage that despite the WCML upgrade works.

It's not really a "despite". As part of the WCML upgrade Silverlink
were bought a stack of new trains and 12-car platform extensions and
probably benefited from the other infrastructure upgrades and
renewals. I'd think this goes a long way to explaining the better
reputation of County.

U

--
http://londonconnections.blogspot.com/
A blog about transport projects in London

"MIG" wrote in message
...
On Jan 12, 6:02 pm, (Neil Williams)
wrote:
On Sat, 12 Jan 2008 17:57:33 -0000, "Lew 1"

wrote:
Only once or twice, not enough to really form an opinion. I hadn't
thought
that the difference between County and Metro would have been so huge,
though
it certainly looks like it was County that was getting the praise. (What
was
the Abbey Flyer, County or Metro?)

County, as were the erstwhile London-Brum locals and the
London-Northampton commuter services that I use daily.

I find it strangely amusing that one set of passengers would have related
the brand "Silverlink" with the height of railway filth, whilst another
set
saw Silverlink as the railway's Knight in Shining Armour. What difference
one word makes!

It is interesting - I personally have very positive views of the old
Silverlink County, but I agree the old Metro services were disgusting.



How does the shared use of rolling stock work out? I assume that
Watford - St Albans shares stock with the NLL and Bedford - Bletchley
shares stock with the GOBLIN, or is that no longer the case?


It is no longer the case - that's why two ex Silverlink Metro units are now
down in Bristol!

Paul

MIG wrote:

How does the shared use of rolling stock work out? I assume that
Watford - St Albans shares stock with the NLL and Bedford - Bletchley
shares stock with the GOBLIN, or is that no longer the case?

I'm not sure about the new arrangement for the St Albans Flyer but the
Marston Vale line is now resourced by London Midland, as part of their
franchise. Class 150s from the West Midlands fleet are used.

Mr Thant wrote:
On 12 Jan, 18:54, Paul Corfield wrote:
Silverlink County did have a rocky patch a number of years ago but
like a number of Nat Ex TOCs they just knuckled down and
concentrated on the basics. IIRC they had the most reliable EMUs
in Britain with their fleet of Class 321s based at Bletchley. For
a railway getting the most boring basics right day in, day out is
absolutely essential and they did seem to manage that despite the
WCML upgrade works.

It's not really a "despite". As part of the WCML upgrade Silverlink
were bought a stack of new trains and 12-car platform extensions and
probably benefited from the other infrastructure upgrades and
renewals. I'd think this goes a long way to explaining the better
reputation of County.

It was perhaps also the fact that County maintained their "old" trains
superbly. Their Class 321 reliability was the best of any National Rail
train type for the second year running, and their average miles per
casualty*, at 49,244, was more than twice the figure for One's fleet of
the same class.

By contrast, Metro's fleet of Class 313, admittedly around 13 years
older but maintained in the same Bletchley depot, achieved a miserable
5189 miles per casualty last year, compared to FCC's 11,355 mpc with the
same class.

* Strictly, it's the moving annual average of total miles run divided by
the number of train faults causing at least a 5-minute delay. Figures
from Modern Railways, January 2008.

--
Richard J.
(to e-mail me, swap uk and yon in address)

I decided on an observational survey trip last Wednesday afternoon to
the former BR/Bakerloo Line joint stations "north of Harrow" on the DC
Lines.

Headstone Lane - ticket office closed, no UTS gates, no visible staff.
Hatch End - ticket office open, no UTS gates, no other visible staff.
Carpenders Park (a dreadful early-1950s BR hole accessed through dodgy
local authority aubways) - ticket office open, no UTS gates, no other
visible staff.
Bushey - ticket office open, no UTS gates, no other visible staff.
Watford High Road - ticket office open, UTS gates fitted and in use,
about 4 revenue staff in ticket hall.
Watford Junction - ticket office open, UTS gates fitted and in use,
visible staff but presumably all part of the London Midland operation.

Temporary exterior LO signs at all LO stations except Hatch End which
I suppose might require listed building consent?

Had my ticket checked for the first ever on the former Silverlink
Metro system, the squad on the 3-car train were at least 8-strong!

I'm sure the Mayor's promises regarding ticket office opening and
general staffing is not being met at many LO stations, and even some
of the new Bakerloo Line stations seem deserted much of the time.

On 12 Jan, 19:57, "Paul Scott" wrote:
How does the shared use of rolling stock work out? *I assume that
Watford - St Albans shares stock with the NLL and Bedford - Bletchley
shares stock with the GOBLIN, or is that no longer the case?

Wikipedia says the St Albans branch normally had a 321, so the split
doesn't affect it.

U

--
http://londonconnections.blogspot.com/
A blog about transport projects in London

Richard J. wrote:

By contrast, Metro's fleet of Class 313, admittedly around 13 years
older but maintained in the same Bletchley depot, achieved a miserable
5189 miles per casualty last year, compared to FCC's 11,355 mpc with
the same class.

Intially Bletchley but, more recently, Willesden. Reliability plummeted when
Willesden took over responsibility.