On 25 Jan, 16:31, "Paul Scott" wrote:
"Mizter T" wrote in message

(snip)

And just to prove that things can change for the better, the
"Transfare" ticket scheme has recently been simplified - these are
tickets that allow for through journeys from bus to Metro or vice-
versa. However, perhaps just so as to ensure things don't get too
simple the new Transfare scheme has introduced the new idea of
concentric yellow, green, and grey zones - thankfully these do
actually correspond with the Metro's concentric A, B and C zones, and
they also share the same colours except for Metro zone C being a shade
of violet whilst the outer Transfare zone is grey. I suppose the logic
is that the Transfare grey zone covers much more ground than the Metro
C zone.

Anyhow, here is a page on the new Transfare ticket scheme...
http://www.nexus.org.uk/wps/wcm/conn...es+and+tickets...

...and this leaflet shows the new Transfare yellow/green/grey zones
(PDF)...
http://www.nexus.org.uk/wps/wcm/reso...e4fbc9c/Transf...

The world is complicated!

But it was definitely worth pointing out, if only to demonstrate how easy it
will be to program a national Oyster payg...

Paul S


Perhaps my sarcasm detector isn't working, but I'll take your comment
at face value!

One issue with implementing this Transfare scheme with some kind of
smartcard PAYG system would be the fact that neither bus fares nor
Transfares are flat-rate - look at the leaflet's example of a journey
where a passenger transfers from the Metro at Pelaw in the green zone
and then takes a bus to Washington in the grey zone. The passenger
would have to actively inform the driver of their final destination,
and the driver would have to enter this into their ticket machine and
then have the passenger scan the smartcard so as to ensure the correct
fare was debited. The only other way of doing it would be to implement
a touch-in and touch-out system on buses, which I think would be
totally unworkable.

In fact this has prompted me to start a new thread on utl to ask about
whether Oyster could theoretically support a distance based, non-flat
fare system - the thread is called "Oyster PAYG and differential bus
fares".

On Fri, 25 Jan 2008 10:27:14 -0800 (PST), Mizter T
wrote:

One issue with implementing this Transfare scheme with some kind of
smartcard PAYG system would be the fact that neither bus fares nor
Transfares are flat-rate - look at the leaflet's example of a journey
where a passenger transfers from the Metro at Pelaw in the green zone
and then takes a bus to Washington in the grey zone. The passenger
would have to actively inform the driver of their final destination,
and the driver would have to enter this into their ticket machine and
then have the passenger scan the smartcard so as to ensure the correct
fare was debited. The only other way of doing it would be to implement
a touch-in and touch-out system on buses, which I think would be
totally unworkable.

It is entirely workable in Singapore (yes, I know, different culture,
but still...). If the method of operation was to charge the maximum
fare for that bus on touch-in and refund the difference on touch-out,
people would soon be motivated to touch in and out correctly, just as
they seem to manage on, say, the DLR, and the Dutch are to introduce
it with their system (which is, notably, going away from zones and
towards market fares).

It would need to be made obvious to start with, but that could be done
by having, say, a green reader on the ticket machine for touch-in and
a red one on the left hand side of the doors for touch-out. Indeed,
it'd be simpler and more consistent than the London "remember to
always touch in and out, unless it's a bus in which case only touch
in, and unless it's a bendy bus and you have a season ticket then you
don't need to at all", which is unnecessarily complicated.

Neil

--
Neil Williams
Put my first name before the at to reply.

Neil Williams wrote:

It would need to be made obvious to start with, but that could be done
by having, say, a green reader on the ticket machine for touch-in and
a red one on the left hand side of the doors for touch-out. Indeed,
it'd be simpler and more consistent than the London "remember to
always touch in and out, unless it's a bus in which case only touch
in, and unless it's a bendy bus and you have a season ticket then you
don't need to at all", which is unnecessarily complicated.

You've left out what a 15 year old who lives outside Greater London
needs to do to exit Wimbledon station having arrived by tram ;-)

--
Arthur Figgis Surrey, UK