wrote in message
...
On 20 Mar, 17:25, Mizter T wrote:
On 20 Mar, 17:09, MIG wrote:

Thanks guys for the information.
Today Good Friday, I have been riding the line in both directions,
there seem to be plenty of trains possibly 4 an hour in each
direction. Just get a train from platform 6 at Clapham Junction that
is going next stop Wimbledeon. At Wimbledeon get a Waterloo train with
Clapham Juntion as the first stop.
They did announce on one train that it would be going through East
Putney.
Nice views from the train as travels up alongside the Windsor/ Reading
lines, before branching of to East Putney, then straight through
Southfields and Wimbledeon Park.
District line trains also running on line.
Will be back tommorow to take some photos from East Putney station.
This is a rare opportunity to see frequent service by Network Rail
along this line.

Does that part of LUL have AWS (I don't recall seeing it when I was down
there.)? If not, then whar sort of safety back up are SWT trains using on
that segment, lower speeds? AFAIK, SWT trains are not equipped with
tripcocks.

wrote in message
o.uk...

wrote in message
...
On 20 Mar, 17:25, Mizter T wrote:
On 20 Mar, 17:09, MIG wrote:

Thanks guys for the information.
Today Good Friday, I have been riding the line in both directions,
there seem to be plenty of trains possibly 4 an hour in each
direction. Just get a train from platform 6 at Clapham Junction that
is going next stop Wimbledeon. At Wimbledeon get a Waterloo train with
Clapham Juntion as the first stop.
They did announce on one train that it would be going through East
Putney.
Nice views from the train as travels up alongside the Windsor/ Reading
lines, before branching of to East Putney, then straight through
Southfields and Wimbledeon Park.
District line trains also running on line.
Will be back tommorow to take some photos from East Putney station.
This is a rare opportunity to see frequent service by Network Rail
along this line.

Does that part of LUL have AWS (I don't recall seeing it when I was down
there.)? If not, then whar sort of safety back up are SWT trains using on
that segment, lower speeds? AFAIK, SWT trains are not equipped with
tripcocks.


At the risk of restarting an old thread, although there are tripcocks for LU
trains, the line is still signalled and owned by Network Rail, so I believe
that's why mainline trains don't need tripcocks.

Its possible there isn't AWS - perhaps that explains the 30 mph limit?

Paul

"Paul Scott" wrote in message
...


At the risk of restarting an old thread, although there are tripcocks for
LU trains, the line is still signalled and owned by Network Rail, so I
believe that's why mainline trains don't need tripcocks.


What do they use for a redundant safety system, then?

Slightly off topic, but FCC trains out of Moorgate are equipped with
tripcocks, aren't they? Who is operating that segment of track?

(Having said that, I realise that the trains running from Clapham Junction
to Wimbledon are doing so under extraordinary cicumstances, and so I
wouldn't expect them to be equipped with tripcocks.)

Its possible there isn't AWS - perhaps that explains the 30 mph limit?

I have also seen the speed signs East Putney and Wimbledon, which
distinguish between LUL and NR trains. But, without a redundant saftey
system, I would expect the NR speed to be lower than 30 miles -- more like
15 miles.

On 22 Mar, 10:55, "Paul Scott" wrote:

wrote in message

Does that part of LUL have AWS (I don't recall seeing it when I was down
there.)? If not, then whar sort of safety back up are SWT trains using on
that segment, lower speeds? AFAIK, SWT trains are not equipped with
tripcocks.

At the risk of restarting an old thread, although there are tripcocks for LU
trains, the line is still signalled and owned by Network Rail, so I believe
that's why mainline trains don't need tripcocks.

Wrong. The line is owned by LUL. It used to be owned by British Rail
but on rail privatisation ownership passed to LUL. East Putney to
Wilbledon is still signalled by Network Rail under a contract with
LUL, and I believe Network Rail also handles the power supply. I
understand that maintenance on the line is carried out by the SSL
infraco, Metronet.

However I don't know which signalling rules apply down that line (i.e.
LUL or Network Rail).

Having signalling handled by Network Rail does suggest that some
element of co-ordination is possible in handling the District line
service as well as the diverted SWT trains.


Its possible there isn't AWS - perhaps that explains the 30 mph limit?


Absolutely no idea on that issue.

wrote:

"Paul Scott" wrote:

At the risk of restarting an old thread, although there are tripcocks for
LU trains, the line is still signalled and owned by Network Rail, so I
believe that's why mainline trains don't need tripcocks.


What do they use for a redundant safety system, then?

Dunno, but see my post upthread about the ownership of the line - it
is owned by LUL but signalled by Network Rail.


Slightly off topic, but FCC trains out of Moorgate are equipped with
tripcocks, aren't they? Who is operating that segment of track?


All the 'mainline' lines out of Moorgate are owned by Network Rail
these days, and I'm almost certain that tripcocks are not in use on
either line these days.

The "Northern City line" in a large diameter tube that runs up to
Drayton Park has been in mainline railway ownership since it
transferred from LU to British Rail in 1975 or 76.

What is now the branch of Thameslink to Moorgate is similarly owned
and operated by Network Rail. However the diesel trains that used to
run along this line from Moorgate through Kings Cross (via the York
and Hotel curves) did used to be fitted with tripcocks, because the
line used to be operated by LU. I'm hazy on when the so called
"Widened lines" were separated out between LU and British Rail, so I'm
not sure when LU (Met, Circle and H&C) and mainline trains stopped
sharing these tracks or indeed whether they routinely did so in more
recent years.


(Having said that, I realise that the trains running from Clapham Junction
to Wimbledon are doing so under extraordinary cicumstances, and so I
wouldn't expect them to be equipped with tripcocks.)


At least two SWT trains routinely run along that stretch late at
night/ early in the morning.

wrote:

Does that part of LUL have AWS (I don't recall seeing it when I was
down there.)? If not, then whar sort of safety back up are SWT trains
using on that segment, lower speeds? AFAIK, SWT trains are not
equipped with tripcocks.

The answer is that the line is fitted with TPWS as well as the LUL trainstop
system. At each signal, there is a TPWS loop and a trainstop. The reason
for the 30 mph limit for National Rail trains is because of "power supply
difficulties". The voltage is 650V to accommodate the LU trains, rather
than the usual 750V for SWT.

(Info obtained by Googling for "East Putney AWS" which produced an unlikely
source, the November 2005 edition of the Newsletter of the Institution of
Railway Signal Engineers (Hong Kong Section). See page 17 at
http://www.irse.org.hk/chinese/newsl...ber%202005.pdf )

--
Richard J.
(to email me, swop 'uk' and 'yon' in address)

On Mar 22, 4:00*pm, "Richard J." wrote:
wrote:

Does that part of LUL have AWS (I don't recall seeing it when I was
down there.)? If not, then whar sort of safety back up are SWT trains
using on that segment, lower speeds? AFAIK, SWT trains are not
equipped with tripcocks.

The answer is that the line is fitted with TPWS as well as the LUL trainstop
system. *At each signal, there is a TPWS loop and a trainstop. *The reason
for the 30 mph limit for National Rail trains is because of "power supply
difficulties". *The voltage is 650V to accommodate the LU trains, rather
than the usual 750V for SWT.

Which makes me wonder, is it only 455s that have been using that
route? Could it cope with the power requirements of 450s? I've only
ever seen 455s going that way (daytime empty movements and past
engineering work; not been around for the early/late runs).

MIG wrote:
On Mar 22, 4:00 pm, "Richard J." wrote:
wrote:

Does that part of LUL have AWS (I don't recall seeing it when I was
down there.)? If not, then whar sort of safety back up are SWT
trains using on that segment, lower speeds? AFAIK, SWT trains are
not equipped with tripcocks.

The answer is that the line is fitted with TPWS as well as the LUL
trainstop system. At each signal, there is a TPWS loop and a
trainstop. The reason for the 30 mph limit for National Rail trains
is because of "power supply difficulties". The voltage is 650V to
accommodate the LU trains, rather than the usual 750V for SWT.

Which makes me wonder, is it only 455s that have been using that
route? Could it cope with the power requirements of 450s? I've only
ever seen 455s going that way (daytime empty movements and past
engineering work; not been around for the early/late runs).

Travelled the route on 450s yesterday twice - the Basingstoke/Alton
splitting service. You will be pleased to hear that the power supply can
cope with an 8 car train. It was quite odd to see an 8.450 stopped in East
Putney awaiting the road down on to the Windsor lines - it only just clears
the platform end, and the crossover over the 'LU' down track.

The apparent gradient off the windsor lines is quite something BTW - I
should imagine icy conditions may make things difficult?

I think the normal early and late timetabled trains via EP are usually at
least 450s, not sure if 444s run in service though?

Paul

In article
,
(Mizter T) wrote:

wrote:

"Paul Scott" wrote:

Slightly off topic, but FCC trains out of Moorgate are equipped with
tripcocks, aren't they? Who is operating that segment of track?

All the 'mainline' lines out of Moorgate are owned by Network Rail
these days, and I'm almost certain that tripcocks are not in use on
either line these days.

The "Northern City line" in a large diameter tube that runs up to
Drayton Park has been in mainline railway ownership since it
transferred from LU to British Rail in 1975 or 76.

The GNC retains tripcocks, I thought, with 313s so equipped.

What is now the branch of Thameslink to Moorgate is similarly owned
and operated by Network Rail. However the diesel trains that used to
run along this line from Moorgate through Kings Cross (via the York
and Hotel curves) did used to be fitted with tripcocks, because the
line used to be operated by LU. I'm hazy on when the so called
"Widened lines" were separated out between LU and British Rail, so I'm
not sure when LU (Met, Circle and H&C) and mainline trains stopped
sharing these tracks or indeed whether they routinely did so in more
recent years.

Probably when the changes for Thameslink were made, lengthening the
Farringdon platforms and removing the connection with the Met there.

(Having said that, I realise that the trains running from Clapham
Junction to Wimbledon are doing so under extraordinary
cicumstances, and so I wouldn't expect them to be equipped with
tripcocks.)

At least two SWT trains routinely run along that stretch late at
night/ early in the morning.

The line was BR-owned until 1994, with BR signalling from before then,
surely?

--
Colin Rosenstiel

In article ,
(Paul Scott) wrote:

The apparent gradient off the windsor lines is quite something BTW
- I should imagine icy conditions may make things difficult?

The gradient may be more apparent than real. There is quite a downgrade
from Point Peasant unction to putney station. At both Point Pleasant
Junction and the East Putney approach the line is on road overbridges.
Looking at the OS 1:50,000 map the height difference, judging from the
contour lines, is 10m top whack.

--
Colin Rosenstiel