On Thu, 3 Apr 2008, Tristan Miller wrote:

What is the purpose of the "open" buttons on the doors of the London
Underground carriages? On every Underground train I've used, the doors
open automatically at every station. Is/was there a time or place where
they don't open automatically and the buttons must be used?

Yes - the past. It used to be the case, AIUI, that the driver didn't open
all the doors when the train stopped at a station on the surface, at least
if it was cold and/or wet and not too busy. Then, you'd have to push the
button to open the door. However, this seems to have been too confusing
for passengers, and now all doors always open all the time (except when
they don't).

tom

--
Through the darkness of Future Past the magician longs to see.

On 3 Apr, 21:15, Tom Anderson wrote:
Yes - the past.

And the future. The air-conditioned S stock will have doors that
automatically close if the train stands in a station too long, to keep
the cold air in, and it'll have working door open buttons to get them
open again.

U

--
http://londonconnections.blogspot.com/
A blog about transport projects in London

Mr Thant wrote:

The air-conditioned S stock will have doors that
automatically close if the train stands in a station too long, to keep
the cold air in, and it'll have working door open buttons to get them
open again.

Maybe they should have revolving doors on the trains.

I was once on a crush loaded tube train which pulled into a busy station,
but no-one wanted to board at our particular door, so the outside button was
not pushed. The people inside all had our backs crushed against the curved
door, and when we realised that the door wasn't opening, no-one could work
out where the door button was. Extra door buttons on the ceiling would solve
the problem, or sensors which automatically open [unlocked] doors if the
carriage is crowded.

On Fri, 4 Apr 2008 02:18:37 +0100, John Rowland wrote:

The air-conditioned S stock will have doors that
automatically close if the train stands in a station too long, to keep
the cold air in, and it'll have working door open buttons to get them
open again.

Maybe they should have revolving doors on the trains.

I was once on a crush loaded tube train which pulled into a busy station,
but no-one wanted to board at our particular door, so the outside button was
not pushed. The people inside all had our backs crushed against the curved
door, and when we realised that the door wasn't opening, no-one could work
out where the door button was. Extra door buttons on the ceiling would solve
the problem, or sensors which automatically open [unlocked] doors if the
carriage is crowded.

Or just having the driver open all the doors at busy stations/times.
(This would save time anyway as it would avoid the delay between the
driver releasing the doors and a passenger pressing the button.)

In article ,
lid (asdf) wrote:

Or just having the driver open all the doors at busy stations/times.
(This would save time anyway as it would avoid the delay between the
driver releasing the doors and a passenger pressing the button.)

This makes me ask why some NR stock, e.g. Class 365 networkers, will open
the doors immediately after the driver door release if someone is
pressing the button while newer stock, e.g. Turbostars, Electrostars and
Desiros, not only seem to take longer for the drivers to operate the door
releases in the first place but also will not open the door if the button
is pressed; you have to release it and press again after the door release.
The differences in station dwell times on GN and SWT are horrendous.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

"Colin Rosenstiel" wrote in message
.co.uk...
In article ,
lid (asdf) wrote:

Or just having the driver open all the doors at busy stations/times.
(This would save time anyway as it would avoid the delay between the
driver releasing the doors and a passenger pressing the button.)

This makes me ask why some NR stock, e.g. Class 365 networkers, will open
the doors immediately after the driver door release if someone is
pressing the button while newer stock, e.g. Turbostars, Electrostars and
Desiros, not only seem to take longer for the drivers to operate the door
releases in the first place but also will not open the door if the button
is pressed; you have to release it and press again after the door release.
The differences in station dwell times on GN and SWT are horrendous.

SWT Desiro doors are released by the guard, but only after he has released
his own door and looked down the platform... Not exactly the fastest
operating routine I should think...

Paul S

On Apr 5, 3:05*pm, "Paul Scott"
wrote:
"Colin Rosenstiel" wrote in message

.co.uk...

In article ,
(asdf) wrote:

Or just having the driver open all the doors at busy stations/times.
(This would save time anyway as it would avoid the delay between the
driver releasing the doors and a passenger pressing the button.)

This makes me ask why some NR stock, e.g. Class 365 networkers, will open
the doors immediately after the driver door release if someone is
pressing the button while newer stock, e.g. Turbostars, Electrostars and
Desiros, not only seem to take longer for the drivers to operate the door
releases in the first place but also will not open the door if the button
is pressed; you have to release it and press again after the door release.
The differences in station dwell times on GN and SWT are horrendous.

SWT Desiro doors are released by the guard, but only after he has released
his own door and looked down the platform... *Not exactly the fastest
operating routine I should think...

I'm also fairly sure that plug doors on Networkers are actually faster-
moving than the sliding doors on 376s. The Desiro doors are so slow
that they alone must add to the dwell time.

On Thu, 3 Apr 2008 21:15:19 +0100, Tom Anderson
wrote:

On Thu, 3 Apr 2008, Tristan Miller wrote:

What is the purpose of the "open" buttons on the doors of the London
Underground carriages? On every Underground train I've used, the doors
open automatically at every station. Is/was there a time or place where
they don't open automatically and the buttons must be used?

Yes - the past. It used to be the case, AIUI, that the driver didn't open
all the doors when the train stopped at a station on the surface, at least
if it was cold and/or wet and not too busy. Then, you'd have to push the
button to open the door. However, this seems to have been too confusing
for passengers, and now all doors always open all the time (except when
they don't).

I recall when I first came to London (Autumn 1997) the District line
trains had driver-controlled doors in the summer and
passenger-controlled doors in the winter. I don't recall how
summer/winter were differentiated; possibly by GMT/BST? In any case,
it only lasted a couple of years.

I have heard two possible explanations: one (as you stated) being that
passengers were confused; the other being that there were fears of
passengers using close-door buttons to close the doors on other
passengers.

"James Farrar" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 3 Apr 2008 21:15:19 +0100, Tom Anderson
wrote:


Yes - the past. It used to be the case, AIUI, that the driver didn't open
all the doors when the train stopped at a station on the surface, at least
if it was cold and/or wet and not too busy. Then, you'd have to push the
button to open the door. However, this seems to have been too confusing
for passengers, and now all doors always open all the time (except when
they don't).

I have heard two possible explanations: one (as you stated) being that
passengers were confused; the other being that there were fears of
passengers using close-door buttons to close the doors on other
passengers.

I have heard that the delay caused while pax (both on the train and
platform) realised that they had to open the doors themselves made it
impossible to keep to the timetable...

Paul S

On Apr 3, 9:50*pm, "Paul Scott"
wrote:
"James Farrar" wrote in message

...

On Thu, 3 Apr 2008 21:15:19 +0100, Tom Anderson
wrote:

Yes - the past. It used to be the case, AIUI, that the driver didn't open
all the doors when the train stopped at a station on the surface, at least
if it was cold and/or wet and not too busy. Then, you'd have to push the
button to open the door. However, this seems to have been too confusing
for passengers, and now all doors always open all the time (except when
they don't).
I have heard two possible explanations: one (as you stated) being that
passengers were confused; the other being that there were fears of
passengers using close-door buttons to close the doors on other
passengers.

I have heard that the delay caused while pax (both on the train and
platform) realised that they had to open the doors themselves made it
impossible to keep to the timetable...


It was several years before operators on the Central Line learned how
to release the doors less than 30 seconds after the train had arrived
at a station.

Passengers who had already tried pressing the "open" buttons and found
them to do nothing, quite reasonably didn't notice when they were
eventually unlocked, adding yet more delay.

The same situation now exists on SWT 450s where passengers press the
button and nothing happens. Then the guard eventually releases then
and somebody eventually notices that the light is on and then presses
the button again. Still nothing happens, because the 450 doors are so
incredibly slow, so they press again and again while the doors are
opening.

For some reason the guards don't have the same problem in the 455s.