Oh , its bank holiday and they're closed.

Or you will register your card and check your balance online - Oyster
website is open 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. No excuse now, eh?

On May 8, 11:24 am, alex_t wrote:
Oh , its bank holiday and they're closed.

Or you will register your card and check your balance online - Oyster
website is open 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. No excuse now, eh?

No excuse at all , because obviously I always carry a laptop around
with me wherever I go. Why didn't I think of logging on when I was
standing in that bus queue? Must've just slipped my mind.

B2003

No excuse at all , because obviously I always carry a laptop around
with me wherever I go. Why didn't I think of logging on when I was
standing in that bus queue? Must've just slipped my mind.

No excuse, because judging from your posting frequency you obviously
have an Internet connection around the clock - and may be it's about
time to start using it for something useful, don't you think?

P.S. Oyster website works from mobile phone too - no need for laptop.

On May 8, 12:01 pm, alex_t wrote:
No excuse at all , because obviously I always carry a laptop around
with me wherever I go. Why didn't I think of logging on when I was
standing in that bus queue? Must've just slipped my mind.

No excuse, because judging from your posting frequency you obviously
have an Internet connection around the clock - and may be it's about
time to start using it for something useful, don't you think?

I don't generally have one when I'm out and about you muppet.

P.S. Oyster website works from mobile phone too - no need for laptop.

Not on my cheap pay as you go they don't and even if it did, you think
I'm spending money to check my oyster card balance? Get real.

B2003

I don't generally have one when I'm out and about.

Well, I don't know, you could check before going out - I mean, tens of
thousands of people somehow manage that.

On 8 May, 11:39, Boltar wrote:
On May 8, 11:24 am, alex_t wrote:

Oh , its bank holiday and they're closed.

Or you will register your card and check your balance online - Oyster
website is open 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. No excuse now, eh?

No excuse at all , because obviously I always carry a laptop around
with me wherever I go. Why didn't I think of logging on when I was
standing in that bus queue? Must've just slipped my mind.

B2003

There seems to be a standard pattern to these exchanges.

Person A points out that certain people (eg those living in South
London or occasional visitors) are disadvantaged by rules which need
not be as they are and suggests a simple change to the rules.

Person B pointlessly (I mean helpfully) explains how you can do some
laborious things to avoid the situation.

Person A says yes I know all that, but there are situations where a
person can still legitimately be in a position where they are
disadvantaged (eg machine not working, shop in wrong direction, bank
holiday etc etc), and that rather than them have to get round it, they
are still suggesting that the rule could be changed.

Person C chimes in with something really ludicrous like suggesting
that you are an idiot for not logging into the Web from a bus queue or
planning every journey days in advance.

Person A says for Godsake, I am just pointing out that the unfairness
is unnecessary and could be solved (repeating whatever the suggestion
was, eg normal priced extensions for paper travelcards).

Person B comes back and says "you are making a mountain out of a
molehill".


The thing about all this is not the scale of the molehill, just that
when there is a molehill, however small, for which there is a
solution, it is sheer bloody-mindedness that makes TfL and its
defenders refuse to contemplate addressing it.

Incidentally, I find that no LU barriers seem to do anything other
than let me though, and give no indication of remaining credit.

On May 8, 12:20 pm, MIG wrote:
There seems to be a standard pattern to these exchanges.

Person A points out that certain people (eg those living in South
London or occasional visitors) are disadvantaged by rules which need
not be as they are and suggests a simple change to the rules.

Person B pointlessly (I mean helpfully) explains how you can do some
laborious things to avoid the situation.

Person A says yes I know all that, but there are situations where a
person can still legitimately be in a position where they are
disadvantaged (eg machine not working, shop in wrong direction, bank
holiday etc etc), and that rather than them have to get round it, they
are still suggesting that the rule could be changed.

Person C chimes in with something really ludicrous like suggesting
that you are an idiot for not logging into the Web from a bus queue or
planning every journey days in advance.

Person A says for Godsake, I am just pointing out that the unfairness
is unnecessary and could be solved (repeating whatever the suggestion
was, eg normal priced extensions for paper travelcards).

Person B comes back and says "you are making a mountain out of a
molehill".

The thing about all this is not the scale of the molehill, just that
when there is a molehill, however small, for which there is a
solution, it is sheer bloody-mindedness that makes TfL and its
defenders refuse to contemplate addressing it.

Quite!

B2003

On 8 May, 12:20, MIG wrote:
There seems to be a standard pattern to these exchanges.

Person A points out that certain people (eg those living in South
London or occasional visitors) are disadvantaged by rules which need
not be as they are and suggests a simple change to the rules.
[...]
Person A says for Godsake, I am just pointing out that the unfairness
is unnecessary and could be solved (repeating whatever the suggestion
was, eg normal priced extensions for paper travelcards).

Person B comes back and says "you are making a mountain out of a
molehill".

The thing about all this is not the scale of the molehill, just that
when there is a molehill, however small, for which there is a
solution, it is sheer bloody-mindedness that makes TfL and its
defenders refuse to contemplate addressing it.

In this case, Person A wasn't talking about something sensible and
straightforward like extension fares - they were suggesting that the
price differential between Oyster and paper tickets should be
abolished, despite the fact that paper tickets are substantially more
expensive for TfL to deal with.

Yes, auto-top-up should work on buses, prepay should be valid for all
rail travel within Greater London, etc, and no, the fact that these
don't work isn't the regular punter's fault.

But that doesn't alter the original point, which is that it saves us
all a lot of time and money if people use Oyster; therefore people who
don't use Oyster cost us all a lot of time and money; therefore it's
fair to charge them more for the privilege.

--
John Band
john at johnband dot org
www.johnband.org

On May 8, 5:12*pm, John B wrote:
On 8 May, 12:20, MIG wrote:





There seems to be a standard pattern to these exchanges.

Person A points out that certain people (eg those living in South
London or occasional visitors) are disadvantaged by rules which need
not be as they are and suggests a simple change to the rules.
[...]
Person A says for Godsake, I am just pointing out that the unfairness
is unnecessary and could be solved (repeating whatever the suggestion
was, eg normal priced extensions for paper travelcards).

Person B comes back and says "you are making a mountain out of a
molehill".

The thing about all this is not the scale of the molehill, just that
when there is a molehill, however small, for which there is a
solution, it is sheer bloody-mindedness that makes TfL and its
defenders refuse to contemplate addressing it.

In this case, Person A wasn't talking about something sensible and
straightforward like extension fares - they were suggesting that the
price differential between Oyster and paper tickets should be
abolished, despite the fact that paper tickets are substantially more
expensive for TfL to deal with.

Yes, auto-top-up should work on buses, prepay should be valid for all
rail travel within Greater London, etc, and no, the fact that these
don't work isn't the regular punter's fault.

But that doesn't alter the original point, which is that it saves us
all a lot of time and money if people use Oyster; therefore people who
don't use Oyster cost us all a lot of time and money; therefore it's
fair to charge them more for the privilege.

For people in South London, TfL's feud with NR costs us time and/or
money, because they apply the rules as if Oyster was universally
available. Are we expected to put pressure on our TOCs somehow?

I guess it's the same principle as phone providers charging extra for
calling another network, but they were widely criticised and forced to
change.

On 8 May, 17:12, John B wrote:
In this case, Person A wasn't talking about something sensible and
straightforward like extension fares - they were suggesting that the
price differential between Oyster and paper tickets should be
abolished, despite the fact that paper tickets are substantially more
expensive for TfL to deal with.

Says who? Because they have to deal with money? No one tops up an
Oyster card with cash do they?

But that doesn't alter the original point, which is that it saves us
all a lot of time and money if people use Oyster; therefore people who
don't use Oyster cost us all a lot of time and money; therefore it's
fair to charge them more for the privilege.

********. If it applies to Oyster it applies to every other walk of
life that can use cash as a payment method. TfL are just being tight
fisted arseholes.

B2003