I would like to complain about:

(a) The unavailability of a Super Off Peak fare on a journey Fleet-
Clapham Jn-Shepherds Bush

(b) The inability to buy a ticket with Network Card discount from a LU
ticket office. This was a real pain on Monday on my way back from
Brussels. If they can sell tickets with NR components, why can't they
apply NR discounts?

Anyway: whom do I complain to?

On 5 Dec, 12:25, wrote:
(a) The unavailability of a Super Off Peak fare on a journey Fleet-
Clapham Jn-Shepherds Bush

ATOC or South West Trains.

(b) The inability to buy a ticket with Network Card discount from a LU
ticket office. *This was a real pain on Monday on my way back from
Brussels. *If they can sell tickets with NR components, why can't they
apply NR discounts?

Transport for London. Although they'll tell you NR fares are too
complicated to sell all types and you should be grateful they do them
at all.

U

On 5 Dec, 13:38, Mr Thant
wrote:
On 5 Dec, 12:25, wrote:

(a) The unavailability of a Super Off Peak fare on a journey Fleet-
Clapham Jn-Shepherds Bush

ATOC or South West Trains.

(b) The inability to buy a ticket with Network Card discount from a LU
ticket office. *This was a real pain on Monday on my way back from
Brussels. *If they can sell tickets with NR components, why can't they
apply NR discounts?

Transport for London. Although they'll tell you NR fares are too
complicated to sell all types and you should be grateful they do them
at all.

Thx. Although the latter issue wouldn't have been a problem if they
still sold Network Awaybreaks, or if SWT's ticket office had been open
on Friday afternoon or Saturday morning.

wrote ...
I would like to complain about:
(a) The unavailability of a Super Off Peak fare on a journey Fleet-
Clapham Jn-Shepherds Bush
(b) The inability to buy a ticket with Network Card discount from a LU
ticket office. This was a real pain on Monday on my way back from
Brussels. If they can sell tickets with NR components, why can't they
apply NR discounts?
Anyway: whom do I complain to?

(a) The local TOC for the station you bought the ticket
(b) TfL

(a) + (b) Your Member of Parliament

On all three counts, I suspect you will be wasting your time.
--

Andrew

wrote:
I would like to complain about:

(a) The unavailability of a Super Off Peak fare on a journey Fleet-
Clapham Jn-Shepherds Bush

SWT only introduced SOPs for journeys from outside the London fare zones, to
stations on line of route towards and including London Terminals (Waterloo
effectively). I think you'll get knocked back - you'll find they won't sell
you an SOP anywhere else on the WLL, they don't come up for Olympia or
Willesden Junction either. I suspect it's basically because the leg beyond
CJ up the WLL is someone elses to price, eg LO, and they don't do SOPs. [Or
in the convoluted manner of the modern railway it could even be SN, LM or
Virgin!]

Looking at your other recent post, I think you have to consider the current
'Off Peak Day', as the replacement for the 'Cheap Day Return'. (This is
certainly the standard translation nationally.) SWT's 'Super Off Peak' is a
further discount on journeys towards Waterloo only, ie not really the
equivalent of a CDR. Going back to when SWT introduced their version of the
SOP in May 2007, this was all discussed at length.

In other words many CDRs at that time were given a massive increase in the
London bound direction only, and the SOP was introduced for those particular
journeys, to encourage later travel. One suggestion at the time was why
didn't they redefine the CDR as an 'arrive London after 1200' ticket, and
introduce a new name for the old CDR, I think we now know that the national
roll out of SOPs was only 18 months away, and SWT could have been out of
step with national ticketing rules had they not done as they did.

For fares in the direction away from London, or for any fare that doesn't
involve 'to London' they don't have an SOP at all, the cheapest[1] fare was
the CDR and is now the 'Off Peak Day'. For examples, Fleet to Surbiton has
an SOP, Fareham to Basingstoke doesn't.

Paul S

[1] ignoring Advance when available...

(a) The unavailability of a Super Off Peak fare on a journey Fleet-
Clapham Jn-Shepherds Bush

As the other post says Super off peak was only introduced on flows
where SWT wanted to put the price of the off peak return by a large
amout. where they have not done so then super off peak was not
required.

Thx. *Although the latter issue wouldn't have been a problem if they
still sold Network Awaybreaks, or if SWT's ticket office had been open
on Friday afternoon or Saturday morning.

Your a bit behind the times I am afraid. Network awaybreaks no longer
exists. You need an off peak return which is valid for a month and
which they might sell. If the ticket office is closed and there are
no ticket machines you can buy the ticket on the train. Which station
were you travelling from?

On 5 Dec, 18:36, wrote:

Your a bit behind the times I am afraid. *Network awaybreaks no longer
exists.

I know, it's what I meant.

You need an off peak return which is valid for a month and
which they might sell. *If the ticket office is closed and there are
no ticket machines you can buy the ticket on the train. *Which station
were you travelling from?

Fleet. The ticket office times have become very erratic (they are
proposing to cut them and appear to have pre-empted their own
decision) and I don't think SWT machines sell anything other than day
tickets.

In any case I wanted a London Terminals out and a Travelcard coming
back.

On 5 Dec, 16:09, "Paul Scott" wrote:

SWT only introduced SOPs for journeys from outside the London fare zones, to
stations on line of route towards and including London Terminals (Waterloo
effectively). *I think you'll get knocked back - you'll find they won't sell
you an SOP anywhere else on the WLL, they don't come up for Olympia or
Willesden Junction either. I suspect it's basically because the leg beyond
CJ up the WLL is someone elses to price, eg LO, and they don't do SOPs. *[Or
in the convoluted manner of the modern railway it could even be SN, LM or
Virgin!]

But according to the NRE website, the WLL doesn't do OP returns
either, the only price given is an Anytime ticket at £1.50 single or
£3.00 return. So why can I get an OP return from Fleet but not an SOP
return? I can obviously buy a ticket where Fleet-CJn is priced as an
OP return and CJn-SB as Anytime, but not a combined SOP/Anytime
ticket.

Thanks for the other info about tickets, its very helpful. Up to June
this yeat I had a Fleet-London Stns Gold Card so I was a bit insulated
from all this: I obviously never needed to by a ticket towards London,
and I got the benefit of daytime and evening discounts.

On 6 Dec, 11:59, wrote:
But according to the NRE website, the WLL doesn't do OP returns
either, the only price given is an Anytime ticket at £1.50 single or
£3.00 return. *So why can I get an OP return from Fleet but not an SOP
return? *I can obviously buy a ticket where Fleet-CJn is priced as an
OP return and CJn-SB as Anytime, but not a combined SOP/Anytime
ticket.

SWT seems to have only created SOP fares for journeys within its own
network as far as I can tell.

(also there's no such thing as a "combined" ticket. Every fare between
every pair of stations is set individually, usually by the "lead
operator" for that route)

U

wrote:
On 5 Dec, 16:09, "Paul Scott" wrote:

SWT only introduced SOPs for journeys from outside the London fare
zones, to stations on line of route towards and including London
Terminals (Waterloo effectively). I think you'll get knocked back -
you'll find they won't sell you an SOP anywhere else on the WLL,
they don't come up for Olympia or Willesden Junction either. I
suspect it's basically because the leg beyond CJ up the WLL is
someone elses to price, eg LO, and they don't do SOPs. [Or in the
convoluted manner of the modern railway it could even be SN, LM or
Virgin!]

But according to the NRE website, the WLL doesn't do OP returns
either, the only price given is an Anytime ticket at £1.50 single or
£3.00 return.

As I suggested above, fares between stations on the WLL are probably priced
by LO, like the NLL, and Euston - Watford, and don't offer the full range of
National Rail fares, but only TfL zonal fares.

So why can I get an OP return from Fleet but not an SOP
return?

Because the OP is a ticket type available for NR to LO journeys generally,
but the SOP isn't. I suggest it's because SWT only sell SOPs for point to
point fares within their own network, starting outside the zonal area,
towards London Terminals, and for associated travelcards. I believe you
won't find an SOP for any fare starting within the zonal area, or for any
through fare to a destination beyond London, or via the WLL. I have tested
this from Fleet for Kenny O, Willesden Jn, Watford Jn, Milton Keynes,
Bedford, Stevenage, Shenfield and Dartford - there are no SOPs showing.

I can obviously buy a ticket where Fleet-CJn is priced as an
OP return and CJn-SB as Anytime, but not a combined SOP/Anytime
ticket.

Seems to be so, but I'm pointing out that the new station at Shepherds Bush
isn't a special case, it is consistent with existing SOP availability.

What you have to do is find out if there is anything unfair or illogical
going on somewhere, in which case it might be worth asking SWT. See if SOPs
are available to any Southern or Southeastern destinations? For example, a
Fleet to Battersea Park is available, but it is on 'line of route' to an
appropriate London Terminal, which the WLL isn't.

Paul S