I confess I'd not taken much notice of staffing levels of ticket
offices. They're not really a facility I much use.

Yesterday, though, I needed one when (my own stupid fault), I touched in
at Ruislip Gardens, realised I'd left something in the car and had to
come out again. I looked everywhere for a member of staff (it was
8.10am but I thought when the gates were shut it meant there was someone
somewhere?) But couldn't find anyone to help me.

Anyway, I ended up with GBP1.10 being deducted for a journey I didn't
make.

Arriving at Baker Street I was amazed to find no ticket offices open
there until 9.30am on Saturdays. I can understand closures like this
in the suburbs but at Baker Street??!!

The staff on the gates and one lady helping people use ticket machines
on the Met. Side of the station were being inundated with enquiries and
I felt a bit sorry for them.

Anyway, I later found that, having made another journey ticket office
staff couldn't remove the earlier charge, so Oyster Helpline it was.

*That* didn't prove straightforward either but that's a long
story.......

My main point of surprise is the lack of ticket office openings at even
Central Area stations. I'm genuinely amazed at the Baker Street
scenario. Is it the same now at other "big" Central Area stations?
Did this come in with the New Year or have I just not noticed before?
--
Ian Jelf, MITG
Birmingham, UK

Registered Blue Badge Tourist Guide for London and the Heart of England
http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk

Ian Jelf wrote in
:

I confess I'd not taken much notice of staffing levels of ticket
offices. They're not really a facility I much use.

...

My main point of surprise is the lack of ticket office openings at even
Central Area stations. I'm genuinely amazed at the Baker Street
scenario. Is it the same now at other "big" Central Area stations?
Did this come in with the New Year or have I just not noticed before?

Full details are at http://journeyplanner.tfl.gov.uk/im/SI-T.html (click on
the station name and choose "ticket office opening hours" from the menu).

You will find many on very short hours at weekends or closed completely -
given so many travellers will either have travelcards bought in the sticks
or Pre-Pay it doesn't seem too unreasonable, though if your journey
requires a paper ticket not available from a machine (like mine frequently
does) it can be a right pain!

But I guess it beats having them closed completely, which was the original
plan.

In message . 145, David
Jackman writes
Ian Jelf wrote in
:

I confess I'd not taken much notice of staffing levels of ticket
offices. They're not really a facility I much use.

...

My main point of surprise is the lack of ticket office openings at even
Central Area stations. I'm genuinely amazed at the Baker Street
scenario. Is it the same now at other "big" Central Area stations?
Did this come in with the New Year or have I just not noticed before?

Full details are at http://journeyplanner.tfl.gov.uk/im/SI-T.html (click on
the station name and choose "ticket office opening hours" from the menu).

Hmmm.

That has the Bakerloo office open from 0800 (as a member of staff at the
Met. Gate directed me). However, that was wrong, it was closed until
9.30am.

You will find many on very short hours at weekends or closed completely -
given so many travellers will either have travelcards bought in the sticks
or Pre-Pay it doesn't seem too unreasonable, though if your journey
requires a paper ticket not available from a machine (like mine frequently
does) it can be a right pain!

Indeed.

To be fair, my problem wouldn't have *been* a problem, if the gateline
at Ruislip Gardens had been left open. However, it was closed,
although I could find no trace of a member of staff to let me back out
without touching.

The planner says the ticket office isn't open until 11.00am (which is
what the sign on the closed office there said. So if there was a
member of staff around (which there must have been for the gates to be
closed) where were they?


But I guess it beats having them closed completely, which was the original
plan.

I agree with you (although unstaffed stations are unpopular with the
public at large, I can tell you, from a safety/security point of view).
*That* point was being made on Tyneside in 1980!
--
Ian Jelf, MITG
Birmingham, UK

Registered Blue Badge Tourist Guide for London and the Heart of England
http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk

Ian Jelf wrote in
:


But I guess it beats having them closed completely, which was the
original plan.

I agree with you (although unstaffed stations are unpopular with the
public at large, I can tell you, from a safety/security point of
view). *That* point was being made on Tyneside in 1980!

The plan wasn't unmanned stations, it was to reduce ticket office opening
hours and close some entirely.

You will find a number of central area stations (e.g. Temple, Mansion
House, Aldgate) where the ticket office is closed at weekends and some
others (e.g. Moorgate) where the weekend hours are very restricted indeed
(11.00-15.30 on Saturday, closed Sunday).

In message . 145, David
Jackman writes
Ian Jelf wrote in
:


But I guess it beats having them closed completely, which was the
original plan.

I agree with you (although unstaffed stations are unpopular with the
public at large, I can tell you, from a safety/security point of
view). *That* point was being made on Tyneside in 1980!

The plan wasn't unmanned stations, it was to reduce ticket office opening
hours and close some entirely.

Okay, I see what you mean . If - as was the root of my problem - you
can't *find* a member of staff, though, that effectively renders the
place unmanned, even if it isn't. If you see what I mean! :-)


You will find a number of central area stations (e.g. Temple, Mansion
House, Aldgate) where the ticket office is closed at weekends and some
others (e.g. Moorgate) where the weekend hours are very restricted indeed
(11.00-15.30 on Saturday, closed Sunday).

They are all in or close to The City, though, in areas that are very
quiet.

Baker Street is a very different affair, I would say. Whatever the
day.
--
Ian Jelf, MITG
Birmingham, UK

Registered Blue Badge Tourist Guide for London and the Heart of England
http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk

On Sun, 1 Feb 2009 20:35:25 +0000, Ian Jelf
wrote:

I agree with you (although unstaffed stations are unpopular with the
public at large, I can tell you, from a safety/security point of view).
*That* point was being made on Tyneside in 1980!

Yet in Germany it is very common - even underground stations are
usually completely unstaffed. And there is the question as to whether
two members of staff (say) would be better cooped up in a ticket
office or walking around checking things are OK.

Neil

--
Neil Williams
Put my first name before the at to reply.

In message , Neil Williams
writes
On Sun, 1 Feb 2009 20:35:25 +0000, Ian Jelf
wrote:

I agree with you (although unstaffed stations are unpopular with the
public at large, I can tell you, from a safety/security point of view).
*That* point was being made on Tyneside in 1980!

Yet in Germany it is very common - even underground stations are
usually completely unstaffed.

Indeed. That was the counter-point being made on Tyneside in 1980, not
to mention in the pages of "Modern Tramway" at the time, almost ad
infinitum. :-))


And there is the question as to whether
two members of staff (say) would be better cooped up in a ticket
office or walking around checking things are OK.

I would agree with that 100%, provided you can find someone when you
need them. That is the drawback of having people in this "roving"
role.

I would repeat, though, that a major Central Area station is different
and needs someone staffing a "Ticket Office". I've put that in
inverted commas because they really need people for a *variety* of
things, not really to sell tickets [1] . What the stations really need
is combined Ticket Offices and Travel Centres. Many more of them than
they have at present.



[1] It amazed me, though it shouldn't, at how many people were buying
tickets which they could easily have bought from machines. That said,
I can tell you that London's ticket machines and system baffle a lot of
outsiders. This I suppose is why Baker Street *did* have staff next to
the machines, helping people find out what they wanted to buy, when the
Ticket Office was closed..


--
Ian Jelf, MITG
Birmingham, UK

Registered Blue Badge Tourist Guide for London and the Heart of England
http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk

On 2 Feb, 08:20, Ian Jelf wrote:

[1] * It amazed me, though it shouldn't, at how many people were buying
tickets which they could easily have bought from machines.

That's why one person roving the station explaining how to use the
machines would be a lot more useful than one person serving a massive
queue of people who could use the machine in the ticket office.

Neil

In article ,
(Ian Jelf) wrote:

[1] It amazed me, though it shouldn't, at how many people were
buying tickets which they could easily have bought from machines.
That said, I can tell you that London's ticket machines and system
baffle a lot of outsiders. This I suppose is why Baker Street
*did* have staff next to the machines, helping people find out what
they wanted to buy, when the Ticket Office was closed..

I keep having to go to ticket offices for Oyster top-ups because it's the
only way to get a receipt for the right amount if I don't have the exact
change. Why can't machines allow you to top up a precise amount by card or
by giving change?

--
Colin Rosenstiel

In message , Neil Williams
writes
On Sun, 1 Feb 2009 20:35:25 +0000, Ian Jelf
wrote:

I agree with you (although unstaffed stations are unpopular with the
public at large, I can tell you, from a safety/security point of view).
*That* point was being made on Tyneside in 1980!

Yet in Germany it is very common - even underground stations are
usually completely unstaffed.

I realise that you are a big fan of the German way of doing things and
as a former resident of the BRD.......so am I.

However, there is a difference between most German systems and London.
Far, *far* more outsiders, unfamilliar with the system use London's
transport than that in most German cities.

You might know that for years I used to manage tour on the continent and
was quite used to letting people loose for a free day in a town. It
was *very* rare for people to want to make any use of public transport,
even when I'd explained, in simple terms, how to use it. The very
concept of Entwerter, Grosszone, Merhfahrkarten or even the simplest Day
Ticket and so on was so confusing to people that they just avoided it.
Most headed for a taxi, or complained to me that the coach wasn't taking
them somewhere. A few just boarded trams without tickets and then
ridiculed me in the evening "as they didn't need to buy tickets anyway
they were never checked"! ;-)

Only once, as far as I can recall, did anyone get caught and fined.
That, actually was in Prague.

Anyway, I'm just making the point that where a lot of people unfamilliar
are travelling, you need to be able to find assistance. I appreciate
that this is different from having someone stationed in a "Ticket
Office" as such, though.
--
Ian Jelf, MITG
Birmingham, UK

Registered Blue Badge Tourist Guide for London and the Heart of England
http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk