Robert Coe wrote:

that inscription has also been allowed to deteriorate. It's inlaid (in
a contrasting color) in a marble floor with high pedestrian traffic
and has become quite worn. When I was there fifty years ago, it was
prominent; now some of it is hard to read. It was followed by a verse
from a poem lamenting the Civil War, and that has been all but
obliterated.

Some folk might view that as a healthy way to install a memorial of that
nature. It is after all, only truly a \memorial\ only for as long as
there are still people around who can put faces to the names, and that
is becoming a dwindlingly small number in the case of WW2, is more or
less zero for WW1, and has been zero for the US Civil War for pretty
well a century. Once everyone with the memory stirred by the memorial
has gone, it is just a list of names.

The problem with attempting to keep alive the memories of conflicts for
much longer than the lifetimes of those who actually endured them is
that after a while the wrong messages can be sent, and names such as
Bannockburn, the Boyne and so on end up as rallying calls for a whole
new generation of people with too little perspective and too much hot
blood.

--
http://gallery120232.fotopic.net/p9633069.html
(50 018 under the imposing cliffs at Dawlish, Sep 1984)

On Tue, 22 Dec 2009 15:19:37 +0000, Chris Tolley
(ukonline really) wrote:
: Robert Coe wrote:
:
: that inscription has also been allowed to deteriorate. It's inlaid (in
: a contrasting color) in a marble floor with high pedestrian traffic
: and has become quite worn. When I was there fifty years ago, it was
: prominent; now some of it is hard to read. It was followed by a verse
: from a poem lamenting the Civil War, and that has been all but
: obliterated.
:
: Some folk might view that as a healthy way to install a memorial of that
: nature. It is after all, only truly a \memorial\ only for as long as
: there are still people around who can put faces to the names, and that
: is becoming a dwindlingly small number in the case of WW2, is more or
: less zero for WW1, and has been zero for the US Civil War for pretty
: well a century. Once everyone with the memory stirred by the memorial
: has gone, it is just a list of names.

Maybe, but virtually every American but the most recent immigrzants had at
least one ancestor killed in the Civil War. (The grandchildren of those
immigrants probably will too; the "melting pot" is still very much in
operation.) And interest in Civil War history hasn't waned much over the
years.

: The problem with attempting to keep alive the memories of conflicts for
: much longer than the lifetimes of those who actually endured them is
: that after a while the wrong messages can be sent, and names such as
: Bannockburn, the Boyne and so on end up as rallying calls for a whole
: new generation of people with too little perspective and too much hot
: blood.

Yes, as has been repeatedly pointed out, those who refuse to learn from
history are doomed to repeat it. And alas, you don't even have to wait for the
participants to die off. How, for example, is it possible that we Americans
forgot the lessons of Vietnam so quickly?

Bob

Robert Coe wrote:
On Tue, 22 Dec 2009 15:19:37 +0000, Chris Tolley
(ukonline really) wrote:
: Robert Coe wrote:
:
: that inscription has also been allowed to deteriorate. It's inlaid (in
: a contrasting color) in a marble floor with high pedestrian traffic
: and has become quite worn. When I was there fifty years ago, it was
: prominent; now some of it is hard to read. It was followed by a verse
: from a poem lamenting the Civil War, and that has been all but
: obliterated.
:
: Some folk might view that as a healthy way to install a memorial of that
: nature. It is after all, only truly a \memorial\ only for as long as
: there are still people around who can put faces to the names, and that
: is becoming a dwindlingly small number in the case of WW2, is more or
: less zero for WW1, and has been zero for the US Civil War for pretty
: well a century. Once everyone with the memory stirred by the memorial
: has gone, it is just a list of names.

Maybe, but virtually every American but the most recent immigrzants had at
least one ancestor killed in the Civil War.

I once knew one who said her ancestor had been killed in the War of
Northern Aggression, and spent an evening and a few bottles of beer
explaining why we shouldn't call it a civil war. :-)

--
Arthur Figgis Surrey, UK

On Tue, 22 Dec 2009 18:44:39 +0000, Arthur Figgis
wrote in misc.transport.urban-transit:

Robert Coe wrote:
On Tue, 22 Dec 2009 15:19:37 +0000, Chris Tolley
(ukonline really) wrote:
: Robert Coe wrote:
:
: that inscription has also been allowed to deteriorate. It's inlaid (in
: a contrasting color) in a marble floor with high pedestrian traffic
: and has become quite worn. When I was there fifty years ago, it was
: prominent; now some of it is hard to read. It was followed by a verse
: from a poem lamenting the Civil War, and that has been all but
: obliterated.
:
: Some folk might view that as a healthy way to install a memorial of that
: nature. It is after all, only truly a \memorial\ only for as long as
: there are still people around who can put faces to the names, and that
: is becoming a dwindlingly small number in the case of WW2, is more or
: less zero for WW1, and has been zero for the US Civil War for pretty
: well a century. Once everyone with the memory stirred by the memorial
: has gone, it is just a list of names.

Maybe, but virtually every American but the most recent immigrzants had at
least one ancestor killed in the Civil War.

I once knew one who said her ancestor had been killed in the War of
Northern Aggression, and spent an evening and a few bottles of beer
explaining why we shouldn't call it a civil war. :-)

Indeed, it was a war of regional secession, though those are all called
civil wars.

On Tue, 22 Dec 2009 13:38:10 -0600, Free Lunch
wrote in misc.transport.urban-transit:

On Tue, 22 Dec 2009 18:44:39 +0000, Arthur Figgis
wrote in misc.transport.urban-transit:

Robert Coe wrote:
On Tue, 22 Dec 2009 15:19:37 +0000, Chris Tolley
(ukonline really) wrote:
: Robert Coe wrote:
:
: that inscription has also been allowed to deteriorate. It's inlaid (in
: a contrasting color) in a marble floor with high pedestrian traffic
: and has become quite worn. When I was there fifty years ago, it was
: prominent; now some of it is hard to read. It was followed by a verse
: from a poem lamenting the Civil War, and that has been all but
: obliterated.
:
: Some folk might view that as a healthy way to install a memorial of that
: nature. It is after all, only truly a \memorial\ only for as long as
: there are still people around who can put faces to the names, and that
: is becoming a dwindlingly small number in the case of WW2, is more or
: less zero for WW1, and has been zero for the US Civil War for pretty
: well a century. Once everyone with the memory stirred by the memorial
: has gone, it is just a list of names.

Maybe, but virtually every American but the most recent immigrzants had at
least one ancestor killed in the Civil War.

I once knew one who said her ancestor had been killed in the War of
Northern Aggression, and spent an evening and a few bottles of beer
explaining why we shouldn't call it a civil war. :-)

Indeed, it was a war of regional secession, though those are all called
civil wars.

at least if the region loses the war.

On Tue, 22 Dec 2009 15:19:37 +0000, Chris Tolley
(ukonline really) wrote:

Robert Coe wrote:

that inscription has also been allowed to deteriorate. It's inlaid (in
a contrasting color) in a marble floor with high pedestrian traffic
and has become quite worn

Some folk might view that as a healthy way to install a memorial of that
nature. It is after all, only truly a \memorial\ only for as long as
there are still people around who can put faces to the names, and that
is becoming a dwindlingly small number in the case of WW2, is more or
less zero for WW1, and has been zero for the US Civil War for pretty
well a century.

Not really a Century for the US Civil war, the last Union Veteran died
about 1956 ,last Confederate 1958. Presumably as is the way of
these things there were a fair no that survived to the 1930's and some
long lived ones who made it a further 20 years. Either way there must
be a reasonable no of people around 80 ish who as a child would have
had a Grandad who served in that conflict. By some convoluted method
involving remarriage the last widows pension was paid until 2004.

I agree with your point though.

G.Harman

wrote:

Not really a Century for the US Civil war, the last Union Veteran died
about 1956 ,last Confederate 1958. Presumably as is the way of
these things there were a fair no that survived to the 1930's and some
long lived ones who made it a further 20 years. Either way there must
be a reasonable no of people around 80 ish who as a child would have
had a Grandad who served in that conflict. By some convoluted method
involving remarriage the last widows pension was paid until 2004.

My "pretty well a century" was a finger-in-the-air job. I'm genuinely
surprised that the veterans lasted that long.
--
http://gallery120232.fotopic.net/p13857145.html
("Europe's Heaviest Train" plaque on 59 005 at Merehead, 26 Jun 1994)