On Tue, 10 Nov 2009 15:45:16 -0000, "Paul Scott"
wrote:

Barry Salter has reported seeing some new line maps today, presumably he'll
be able to confirm that the stretch down to Hammersmith has both colours?

My name isn't Barry, but I've seen them as well, and indeed they do.

Neil

--
Neil Williams
Put my first name before the at to reply.

Neil Williams wrote:
On Tue, 10 Nov 2009 12:34:50 -0000, "Paul Scott"
wrote:

But the blinds are definitely being changed en route according to
posters elsewhere. A train leaving Edgware for the inner rail is
supposed to be showing Circle via xxx.

They just show "CIRCLE LINE" normally. Are the blinds to be redone?

Yes, according to posts some months ago in District Dave's forum, at the
time of the early trials...

Paul S

MIG wrote:
On 10 Nov, 20:03, "Paul Scott" wrote:
Mr Thant wrote:

The 2010 frequencies are on slide 15 onwards of this document:
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/assets/downloa...es-Proposed-Se...

So there really is a bit more to it than just the Circle...

So they've changed from the plan to terminate half the Wimblewares at
High Street Ken off peak?

Was that ever a firm official plan, or did posters here just propose it as
an obvious way of reducing the number of trains approaching Edgware Road?

Paul S

On 10 Nov, 21:26, "Paul Scott" wrote:
MIG wrote:
On 10 Nov, 20:03, "Paul Scott" wrote:
Mr Thant wrote:
The 2010 frequencies are on slide 15 onwards of this document:
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/assets/downloa...es-Proposed-Se...

So there really is a bit more to it than just the Circle...

So they've changed from the plan to terminate half the Wimblewares at
High Street Ken off peak?

Was that ever a firm official plan, or did posters here just propose it as
an obvious way of reducing the number of trains approaching Edgware Road?

Paul S

I am pretty sure it was the plan as printed in Modern Railways. But I
couldn't understand why Edgware Road could cope in the peak if it
couldn't cope off-peak. (And I don't really believe it can cope at
all.)

In message
s.com of Tue, 10 Nov 2009 10:30:21 in uk.transport.london, Mr Thant
writes
On 10 Nov, 16:54, "Paul Scott" wrote:
I think I've lost track of that aspect. Weren't there at one time supposed
to be some slight changes to the Met and District to maintain numbers along
the north and south sides of the common routes as well?

The 2010 frequencies are on slide 15 onwards of this document:
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/assets/downloa...ines-Proposed-
Service-Changes.pdf

U

That IS an interesting document. AFAIK, no older posting referred to it.

1) p9/21 graphs "Average excess platform wait time. There are a couple
of text boxes on that graph; for me they seem to use a font which I
don't have and are rendered as gibberish. Do you see them clearly? If
so, please copy to a reply. Later: Foxit Reader renders the text in the
first as "Thisistheaverageam ountofextra tim ethatacustom erhas tow
aitforatraininadditiontotheam ounthe/shew ouldw aitiftheservicew
asrunning perfectly.Thehigherthenum berthew orsetheperformance." (I also
see gibberish is Adobe Reader 9.2) I reckon the message in clear is:
"This is the average amount of extra time that a customer has to wait
for a train in addition to the amount he/she would wait if the service
was running perfectly. The higher the number the worse the performance."
- duplicates "Average extra platform wait time". The second box is
"Circle line".

2) P11/21 is entitled "SSR upgrade". What is "SSR"? I guess something
like "Sub-Surface Railways".

3) Does LU publish reliability data? If so where?
I am unimpressed to see Circle and H&C aggregated on p10/21. Without
sight of the raw data, one can't tell if this is reasonable. The time
units on p9/21 seem to be periods as are those on p10/21. It is a pity
different date ranges were chosen for pp9-10. ISTR seeing a definition
of "period", but can't recall a reference or the definition.

4) p15/21 has a bullet point: "Some current scheduled frequencies are
rarely achieved because run times are unrealistic - new scheduled
frequencies will be closer to the ones that are currently actually
operated". IMHO, this is the most significant point made.

5) I love the way the publicity fails to mention that, as well as losing
Edgware Road - Baker Street, the current Circle line goes from an 8.5
minute timetabled headway to a 10 minute one.

6) I look forward to the near-doubling of AM peak services from Baker
Street to stations beyond Paddington; overloading now is often
comparable to that on the deep lines.

The leaflet at stations has a map which improves current Tube maps - 2
distinct Edgware Road stations and the river. I have failed to find a
pdf of the leaflet on the web. The nearest is http://www.tfl.gov.uk/get
tingaround/13280.aspx. One point in that URL that seems contentious to
me is "Travelling to or from Paddington
All trains via King's Cross St. Pancras will run from the Hammersmith &
City line station - with a more frequent service."
If they change to "Travelling from Paddington ...", truth would be told.
--
Walter Briscoe

On 10 Nov, 21:44, Walter Briscoe wrote:
In message
s.com of Tue, 10 Nov 2009 10:30:21 in uk.transport.london, Mr Thant
writes

On 10 Nov, 16:54, "Paul Scott" wrote:
I think I've lost track of that aspect. Weren't there at one time supposed
to be some slight changes to the Met and District to maintain numbers along
the north and south sides of the common routes as well?

The 2010 frequencies are on slide 15 onwards of this document:
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/assets/downloa...ines-Proposed-
Service-Changes.pdf

U

That IS an interesting document. AFAIK, no older posting referred to it.

1) p9/21 graphs "Average excess platform wait time. There are a couple
of text boxes on that graph; for me they seem to use a font which I
don't have and are rendered as gibberish. Do you see them clearly? If
so, please copy to a reply. Later: Foxit Reader renders the text in the
first as "Thisistheaverageam ountofextra tim ethatacustom erhas tow
aitforatraininadditiontotheam ounthe/shew ouldw aitiftheservicew
asrunning perfectly.Thehigherthenum berthew orsetheperformance." (I also
see gibberish is Adobe Reader 9.2) I reckon the message in clear is:
"This is the average amount of extra time that a customer has to wait
for a train in addition to the amount he/she would wait if the service
was running perfectly. The higher the number the worse the performance."
- duplicates "Average extra platform wait time". The second box is
"Circle line".

I saw gibberish in the PDF as well. But then I pasted it into Word
and got

"This is the average amount of extra time that a customer has to wait
for a train in addition to the amount he/she would wait if the service
was running perfectly. The higher the number the worse the
performance."

and

"Circle line"

as you suggest.

On Tue, 10 Nov 2009 21:00:58 -0000, "Paul Scott"
wrote:

They just show "CIRCLE LINE" normally. Are the blinds to be redone?

Yes, according to posts some months ago in District Dave's forum, at the
time of the early trials...

Interesting - the blind boxes are quite small, so unless they plan on
cutting a bigger hole the font will be very small to fit a via in as
well.

Neil

--
Neil Williams
Put my first name before the at to reply.

In article . 145,
pleasereplytogroup (David Jackman) wrote:

" wrote in
news:65818090-7bfc-4c42-
:

Revised maps etc. at
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/gettingaround/13280.aspx

Changing at Edgware Road made to seem like a piece of cake in the
blurb.

No change at Edgware Road required.

Journey planner's first two suggestions for a journey from Earl's
Court to Kings Cross at 19:58 on 17th December having selected no
stairs, no escalators are both District line to Gloucester Road
then Circle line via High Street Kensington...

That won't be possible after 13 December. There will be no guaranteed
step-free route from Earl's Court to King's Cross.

I tried Fulham Broadway to Kings Cross St Pancras without stairs from the
TfL Journey Planner. Apparently all Edgware Road trains will terminate at
platform 2 at Edgware Road so one can have a stairs free change there.

This would also appear to be because the Journey Planner thinks there will
still be a Circle Line service from king's Cross to High St Kensington on
14 December! Bloody useless!



--
Colin Rosenstiel

wrote:

That won't be possible after 13 December. There will be no guaranteed
step-free route from Earl's Court to King's Cross.

Yes there will - the Circles will all terminate alongside the Barkingbound
platform, and the Wimblewares will all terminate alongside the
Hammersmithbound platform. (Or was it the other way around?)

Anyway, no-one's mentioned the most important thing. Circle Line pub crawls
will now be 8 pints longer. This could lead to a million deaths from alcohol
poisoning. Or at the very least increase national expenditure on underpants,
at a time when Britain, despite Gordon Brown's statements to the contrary,
is the nation least well equipped to weather the storm of increased
underpant expenditure.

--
We are the Strasbourg. Referendum is futile.

On Tue, 10 Nov 2009 13:38:03 -0800 (PST), MIG wrote:

I am pretty sure it was the plan as printed in Modern Railways. But I
couldn't understand why Edgware Road could cope in the peak if it
couldn't cope off-peak. (And I don't really believe it can cope at
all.)

Did they attempt to run a weekday peak service on any of the trial
weekends?