On 24 Nov, 19:58, Paul Terry wrote:
In message , Tim Roll-Pickering
writes

It is only needed if you have a season/travelcard on your Oyster and you
want to use PAYG in order to pay for an out-of-zone journey.
Yes but if you have the season/travelcard already on it's difficult to use
PAYG. For instance if I have a Zones 1-3 travelcard and want to go Forest
Gate (Z3) to Ilford (Z4) I *can't* just use PAYG - I will *have* to get an
OEP which won't be available at my local starting station.

Agreed - you'd have to go to the Oyster shop just opposite the station.
OTOH, you can add the OEP at any time and from any convenient place that
supplies it - it costs nothing and it remains there to use for whenever
you want it.

But I suspect that NR ticket offices in the London area will eventually
provide the full range of Oyster services - it would be madness not to
do so.

And no doubt the paper extension fare will be whacked up to punish me
for not buying something unavailable to me.

It's not "unavailable" unless you can't cross the road to the Oyster
shop, and I've not seen any evidence in the 2010 fares tables of zone
extension tickets being "whacked up".
--
Paul Terry

Just off the top of my head ... Where is the Oyster shop just over
the road from

St Johns
Lewisham

On 25 Nov, 11:12, "Paul Scott" wrote:
Paul Terry wrote:
In message , Paul Corfield
writes

I doubt that many NR stations will end up selling the full range of
Oyster services. *We're £40m down in terms of this upgrade and there
is little expansion of Oyster capable retailing as a result. It's
only at joint stations plus whatever LOROL has taken over from
former TOCs. *Why do you imagine there has been such a massive
expansion and re-equipment of the Oyster Ticket Stop network?

I wonder why the money spent on this expansion was not used to provide
Oyster retail facilities at NR stations. Surely that would have been
more useful to passengers, given the likely shift from paper tickets
to Oyster on NR throughout London?

The media briefing 'FAQs' suggests that Oyster PAYG top ups at least will be
available at 'most NR stations', presumably via modifications to the TVMs..

There are already some TOC stations where Oyster Travelcards are retailed,
maybe these will be increased as well?

Paul S

I found it rather odd that New Cross Gate, which used to have Oyster
facilities, no longer has them.

MIG wrote:

I found it rather odd that New Cross Gate, which used to have Oyster
facilities, no longer has them.

Is that because they had separate LU ticket machines there, or machines
linked to LU? Would they have been taken out as part of the transfer of the
line to LO, ie the removal isn't necessarily permanent?

Paul S

On Nov 25, 11:23*am, MIG wrote:
On 25 Nov, 11:12, "Paul Scott" wrote:



Paul Terry wrote:
In message , Paul Corfield
writes

I doubt that many NR stations will end up selling the full range of
Oyster services. *We're £40m down in terms of this upgrade and there
is little expansion of Oyster capable retailing as a result. It's
only at joint stations plus whatever LOROL has taken over from
former TOCs. *Why do you imagine there has been such a massive
expansion and re-equipment of the Oyster Ticket Stop network?

I wonder why the money spent on this expansion was not used to provide
Oyster retail facilities at NR stations. Surely that would have been
more useful to passengers, given the likely shift from paper tickets
to Oyster on NR throughout London?

The media briefing 'FAQs' suggests that Oyster PAYG top ups at least will be
available at 'most NR stations', presumably via modifications to the TVMs.

There are already some TOC stations where Oyster Travelcards are retailed,
maybe these will be increased as well?

Paul S

I found it rather odd that New Cross Gate, which used to have Oyster
facilities, no longer has them.

Odd why? PAYG isn't valid there while the ELL's shut, so providing top-
ups etc would only lead to confusion.

--
John Band
john at johnband dot org
www.johnband.org

On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 01:43:33PM +0000, Paul Terry wrote:

In what way is it more complicated than the present system, which
requires people to remember to purchase an extension ticket if they wish
to travel beyond the zones they have paid for?

At the moment it's simple - PAYG doesn't work, so you can't use it.

(ignoring the few routes where it does work and is already complicated)

--
David Cantrell | top google result for "internet beard fetish club"

Did you know that shotguns taste like candy canes? Put the barrel in
your mouth and pull the trigger for an extra blast of minty goodness!

On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 05:04:47PM +0000, Paul Terry wrote:

But how does that make an OEP more complicated than buying a zone
extension ticket?

You can buy zone extension tickets at stations. OEPs will, as I
understand it, only be available at shops outside stations.

And in any case, "I've got a travelcard and a big enough PAYG balance,
therefore I've already got a zone extension ticket and it should Just
Work because Oyster is meant to make things simple and convenient".

--
David Cantrell | Godless Liberal Elitist

There are many different types of sausages. The best are
from the north of England. The wurst are from Germany.
-- seen in alt.2eggs...

David Cantrell wrote:
On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 05:04:47PM +0000, Paul Terry wrote:

But how does that make an OEP more complicated than buying a zone
extension ticket?

You can buy zone extension tickets at stations. OEPs will, as I
understand it, only be available at shops outside stations.

See my earlier post, (at 1101) giving a different story, via FCC website.

Paul S

On Tue, Nov 24, 2009 at 07:58:08PM +0000, Paul Terry wrote:
In message , Tim Roll-Pickering
writes
Yes but if you have the season/travelcard already on it's difficult to use
PAYG. For instance if I have a Zones 1-3 travelcard and want to go Forest
Gate (Z3) to Ilford (Z4) I *can't* just use PAYG - I will *have* to get an
OEP which won't be available at my local starting station.
Agreed - you'd have to go to the Oyster shop just opposite the station.
OTOH, you can add the OEP at any time and from any convenient place that
supplies it - it costs nothing and it remains there to use for whenever
you want it.

Although you can only have one on there, and only use it once, so if you
make that journey fairly often (but not often enough to make a
travelcard worthwhile) then you have to visit that grotty little shop
every time, and hope that the spotty youth working there on that day
knows what the hell you're talking about, and that the equipment works.

My experience of trying to buy Oyster in shops outside the centre
indicates that this will not work well.

But I suspect that NR ticket offices in the London area will eventually
provide the full range of Oyster services - it would be madness not to
do so.

Yes, I expect they will eventually. Only when they do - all of them -
will I consider PAYG to be usable. And there need to be several
machines in the station from which to collect OEPs, to avoid queueing
and to make Oyster (mostly) simple and convenient. Or OEPs need to be
abolished. Stations will also need to be able to deal with Oystery
problems, setting up of auto-topup, and all the other things that
currently require a visit to a tube station or an expensive premium-rate
phone call.

And no doubt the paper extension fare will be whacked up to punish me
for not buying something unavailable to me.
It's not "unavailable" unless you can't cross the road to the Oyster
shop, and I've not seen any evidence in the 2010 fares tables of zone
extension tickets being "whacked up".

Please could you let me know where the nearest *competent* Oyster shop
is to Thornton Heath station whose equipment actually works? Last time
I asked TfL they couldn't tell me. The nearest shop, according to them,
was about ten minutes walk away, and their machine was broken. The
other two they suggested didn't know how to work the machine, and didn't
have any cards to sell.

--
David Cantrell | Cake Smuggler Extraordinaire

When a man is tired of London, he is tired of life
-- Samuel Johnson

In message , Paul Scott
writes

Paul Terry wrote:
I wonder why the money spent on this expansion was not used to provide
Oyster retail facilities at NR stations. Surely that would have been
more useful to passengers, given the likely shift from paper tickets
to Oyster on NR throughout London?

The media briefing 'FAQs' suggests that Oyster PAYG top ups at least will be
available at 'most NR stations', presumably via modifications to the TVMs.

That's certainly what I would have expected to see in the absence of
Oyster availability at ticket offices.

--
Paul Terry

In message , David
Cantrell writes

You can buy zone extension tickets at stations. OEPs will, as I
understand it, only be available at shops outside stations.

As Paul S has pointed out, the media briefing claims they will be
available at "most NR stations". How this turns out in practice is yet
to be seen, of course, but it would be the logical thing to do.

And in any case, "I've got a travelcard and a big enough PAYG balance,
therefore I've already got a zone extension ticket and it should Just
Work because Oyster is meant to make things simple and convenient".

It doesn't seem to me to be harder than having to remember, at present,
that the PAYG element on an Oyster can only be used on a very limited
number of NR lines. Or that a Freedom card can only be used after a
certain time on NR and only to certain stations... or having to remember
any of the other ticketing restrictions encountered in modern life.
--
Paul Terry